I have one email in my inbox with some information. This person has a 6/28 LID and her agency feels there is a chance she may get her referral this month, but if not this month then for sure next month. It’s one of the lesser known agencies - I’ve heard the name before but not really sure of the size.
So, with the lack of rumors floating around I’ll open up anon posting for a bit and see what we come up with.
This will be the chat thread. I’ll make another post for the rumors thread.
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May 15th, 2006 at 2:38 pm
To the person who just emailed me with a question - the answer to your question is: lovekids
To everyone else, sorry for the cryptic comment.
May 15th, 2006 at 2:47 pm
I LID of 6/28, and I have been thinking this is a possibility as well. I have no rumors to substantiate it, just a thought that it is possible. :)
May 15th, 2006 at 3:08 pm
I’m responding to Michitakem from the rumor thread over here.
I would guess it’s primarily:
1. There are still PLENTY of female children/babies going without an adoption, but for PR reasons China wants it to look like there is a sudden scarcity
The question is why? Olympics? Saving Face?
I don’t know.
May 15th, 2006 at 3:24 pm
Any Canadians out there?? Just a few questions about SN adoptions in Canada:
- I have heard you can be matched by the CCAA, how does this work if you are already logged in for NSN. Do you need to be logged in again?? How long does it take?
- Does Canada get SN photolistings? How many? Which agencies? How often.
With a January LID, we are just wondering about our possibilities.
May 15th, 2006 at 3:35 pm
Re: the beijing orphanage report. I didnt see the report, but i imagined that the reporter was probably talking about an orphanage with older girls. There could well be ‘1000 girls in an orphanage who will never find homes’ if they are 3-15 years old. Orphanages arent only full of babies ages 1-12 months old –the ones we will probably get our babies from. I dont have exact figures, but i would guess the majority of orphanges in china are full of older girls who have aged out of the system.
Since china severely limits the number of babies who can be adopted out internationally, you’ve got a ton of girls who will stay there all their lives…
May 15th, 2006 at 3:41 pm
ok, anon 3:24 as far as I know, to change from NSN to SN, you need to get a letter from your SW, talk to your facilitator on what they need, but you need to submit the letter stating which SN you will accept. There are some lists in Canada, but not like the US where they are all posted. From what I understand, the lists are matched pretty quickly. So, you would most likely be matched by CCAA. And right now the wait time is somewhere around 6 mth. Talk to your facilitator and SW though they should know what to do!
May 15th, 2006 at 3:43 pm
When we visited my daughter’s orphanage the only older kids were obvious SN kids. Someone in our group asked about older kids and was told most babies get adopted. They told us there were 145 kids in the orphanage and that 17 of them were older than 2 years old.
May 15th, 2006 at 3:43 pm
ok, I am sure I already know what “paper ready” babies mean, but can someone give me what their interpretation is?
May 15th, 2006 at 3:45 pm
O1E: “paper ready” means babies that have paperwork prepared that makes them eligible for international adoption.
May 15th, 2006 at 4:04 pm
Not to raise ANY hopes, but we are LID 15th July in the UK and our travel agency e mailed us today to say that we should receive our referral next month. BUT who knows, it may be a case of telling us what we want to hear
May 15th, 2006 at 4:13 pm
4:04 pm,
Why is your travel agency telling you when you should receive a referral? Just curious
May 15th, 2006 at 4:31 pm
Oscar1Elmo,
Thank you! 6 mths to referral for a SN match through the CCAA- I guess this could be quicker if the CCAA used your original LID, but if you needed to start all over again, it could probably take longer than NSN (especially with Ontario taking 12 weeks to make approvals). Anyone know how the whole LID thing works for SN?
May 15th, 2006 at 4:34 pm
Just curious, but isn’t it way easier and cheaper to get a SN baby here? Why go all the way to China except to get a healthy baby? Just wondering
May 15th, 2006 at 4:38 pm
MCEK, UKers often use BLAS for our in-country travel and guiding. Sounds like this person is doing so. I hope they’re right!
May 15th, 2006 at 5:13 pm
I am the person who posted from the UK re news from our travel agency. China Womens Travel. They are closely affiliated with the CCAA, but I feel that the information should not be taken too seriously as I have had e mail from BLAS which is an organisation also closely linked to the CCAA who are refusing point blank to give any hints as to when we will hear. I think we are all completely in the dark - clutching at straws & will probably get a better idea of how things are going when the next set of referrals are sent out.
May 15th, 2006 at 5:30 pm
Sorry for the repost, I should have posted it here to begin with:
Does anyone have any feedback for my comment posted yesterday that Fox News discussed International Adoption in a news segment Sunday, and Congresswoman Anne Northup of KY said that she had been in an orphanage in Beijing recently and there were (her words) “about 1000 girls that will likely never have the chance to be adopted by anyoneâ€.
The story steamed me a bit considering all of the rumors going around about “not enough children for IAâ€.
So what do you think? Here are my theories:
1. There are still PLENTY of female children/babies going without an adoption, but for PR reasons China wants it to look like there is a sudden scarcity
2. The delay is not about a lack of children, but a lack of staff at the CCAA.
3. The Olympics are coming up, and there is an effort to scale back on the very visible International Adoptions. (Americans holding babies in the streets)
4. There really is a shortage of healthy babies, and the Beijing orphanage the Congresswoman visited was filled with unfortunate children who are older or have defects (in other words not the “healthy, as young as possible†children).
May 15th, 2006 at 5:38 pm
Thanks for the reply, friends. I should have refreshed, my browser came up with only a couple of replies so I didn’t see your responses until after I reposted above.
Eli, you wrote:
“Since china severely limits the number of babies who can be adopted out internationally, you’ve got a ton of girls who will stay there all their lives…”
How is China limiting the babies? Does this then run counter to the claim that there are less babies available for adoption in China due to things like more domestic adoption?
Also, if it is significantly easier to adopt older children, I may consider this if we do it again. I originally had planned to adopt 2-3 years old, but my agency recommended against it. Now I feel like perhaps we should have stuck with our original plan. The thought of 1000 girls growing up in an orphanage somewhere in Beijing just because they aren’t young enough to qualify for the AYAP demands of so many, the thought of them moving to work for some extremely low wage factory job, having never known real parents is very saddening.
Also, if anyone saw the report there was some horrific news about some East European children (I forget the exact country name, former Soviet Union I think) being kept in cages, just terrible…
May 15th, 2006 at 5:43 pm
dunedin you said:
“Just curious, but isn’t it way easier and cheaper to get a SN baby here? Why go all the way to China except to get a healthy baby? Just wondering”
My guess is that China’s definition of “SN” is different from ours, or even from other countries.
Children with issues in East Europe, for instance, could have been fetal alcohol syndrome kids, and children with issues in the US could have been exposed to hard drugs. The general thought seems to be that children abandoned in China for problems are usually girls and it could be something relatively minor and easily correctible - but the straw that breaks the camel’s back, so to speak, for the birth parents in a country which traditionally favors male children, especially when you can only have one child.
May 15th, 2006 at 6:01 pm
Michitakem~
I don’t think its any easier to adopt an older child, which doesn’t make any sense. We have requested a nsn 3-5 year old girl. We were told its doable but it might take longer. I am 42 and my husband is 47 - we are technically eligible by CCAA guidelines, to adopt a child as old as three. I am sure there are plenty of children in this age group that aren’t “paper-ready” - I am just not sure as to why.
May 15th, 2006 at 6:44 pm
Can anyone answer me this…we get SO many questions about why aren’t we adopting domestically…I have my standard answers, and then I hear about people who have taken in and adopted several neglected children that are about 2 years old. How did they get those children?? I’d LOVE one of those babies, but I didn’t think it was hardly possible.
May 15th, 2006 at 6:57 pm
I wish everyone would take some time and educate themselves about today’s China. I know some differences between America and China are hard to understand until you have actually been there but, in order to really understand all the misinformation and non-information, you need to understand the country a bit. China is a country that does not tell its own citizens the truth about, well, most things. Why then, do we even allow ourselves to think, even for a moment, that they would tell us anything? It is never going to happen. The truth is that there is a huge population of Chinese who live not in cities and still live their lives according to the old world traditions and ideologies. This is a huge reason why it will take decades (if ever) for children to no longer be abandonded. To this day, even with all the publicity and documentaries, dying rooms still exist. There is no great rush by the Chinese to embrace these children who are in orphanages, regardless of whether or not they are special needs. Everyone needs to calm down and understand that what motivates the Chinese government and the CCAA to lengthen the wait or shorten it has nothing to do with anything other than the fact that they can. Policitally and economically, there is little, if any, incentive for them to stretch the wait out to a point that we will start running to other countries instead of them to adopt. When you see how most people live, you will understand how important the millions of dollars we add to their economy while we are there is so very important to them.
Also, please be aware that there are many, many, many adoption agencies here in the US that are not your most knowledgeable or truthful. That, unfortunately, is a fact. My guess is that many of you know that or else why are you looking to find out what other’s are saying? The only information that I would even remotely “trust” is information given by the China only program, more conservative, better known agencies. They are the ones who actually have a real realationship with the CCAA and have any “pull” in China.
Its frustrating when you’ve been waiting your whole life for your child. But, time spent wondering why the CCAA does or doesn’t do something or whether or not they understand (or even care) about your feelings or struggles or fingerprints or paperwork, would be better spent learning about the country that your child lives in today, not just the culture of yesterday.
May 15th, 2006 at 8:41 pm
As far as why we didn’t consider domestic adoption:
1. Birth mothers can change their minds
2. A friend spent a year waiting for siblings who were in the foster care system who then did 3,000 dollars of damage to their house by throwing bricks through windows, etc. Out of control, destructive kids they thought they knew as nice little children before they came.
3. You have to “sell yourself” to birth mothers who then judge your worthiness to be a parent, with more potential for rejection.
4. Chinese adoption is smoother, more likely to be something that won’t leave you childless again after some kind of rejection or reclamation of rights by the birth mother. The young children have not been made bitter or destructive like some of those in the American foster care system.
Are these perfect reasons? No, but Domestic adoption should be much easier than it is, and should not be a place for parents who’ve suffered setbacks from infertility to encounter even more setbacks and rejections. By comparison, even a 6 month delay by Chinese adoption CCAA delays seems inconsequential in the end.
May 15th, 2006 at 8:48 pm
Reality check, you took the words right out of my mouth or should I say “key pad”
May 15th, 2006 at 9:28 pm
As far as the older children in China being adoptable, children over the age of 6 are catagorized into ’special needs’. You can get a healthy child over the age of 6 through the waiting child program. Current wait for referral for a SN child is 3-4 months from LID. Some people who are already logged in with my agency(large, China only) who have switched over from NSN to SN have gotten a referral within a month. It’s currently 2-3 months to travel. Profiles for SN children come in at a steady pace now, not the same as traditional referrals.
May 15th, 2006 at 9:56 pm
mmm…. SN referrals are faster and seem to be more predictable than the NSN program (6 mos LID to referral).
Apparently, once you are logged in a NSN you don’t have to pull out to relog in as a SN…. ie. the processing that they have already done on your dossier still counts, you just add the extra docs and they shift you to the other program.
Check that with your agency, it’s what mine told me!
May 15th, 2006 at 9:57 pm
Reality Check wrote “But, time spent wondering why the CCAA does or doesn’t do something or whether or not they understand (or even care) about your feelings or struggles or fingerprints or paperwork, would be better spent learning about the country that your child lives in today, not just the culture of yesterday.”
Hm. If time spent reading this site and wondering about what the CCAA will do next is better spent in other matters, what are you doing on this site?
May 16th, 2006 at 11:38 am
We requested a daughte 2-6 yrs, not AYAP. Hoping that we will get closer to the 6 yrs. We have an 8 yr old and do not want too much of a difference. Though the wait will be longer than the longest we expected, we are hopeful that they will be able to match us with an older child, so this is a ray of hope to us. LID 10/28