More early referrals
I’ll be honest here and say that I’ve sat on this one for a bit without reporting it. I wanted to try to verify it, which I have still not been able to do. But, it has now apparently hit a few boards, and a lot of people have heard it now, so I may as well report it before it makes the rounds and turns into something even more than what it appears to be.
And what it appears to be, is that families with an April of 2006 LID have their referrals and plan to travel in November. Here is what I have been told:
- This is not the agency that received early referrals before.
- This is (again) an entire travel group.
- These families are not in the special needs program.
- These families are not expedited due to Chinese heritage.
- The families are reported to be shocked, they were not expecting this.
- The agency shows 14-18 months between DTC and referral on their web site. And, coincidentally, the April people just waited 18 months.
I don’t know if the agency has December through March LID’s. And, if they do, I don’t know if they have referrals or not for those families. I think that would be pretty important information to have, if anyone knows.
When I reported this the last time I had information that told me it had happened, it wasn’t just a rumor. This time I do not know 100% for sure that it has happened. No one with an early referral has contacted me, but there are people who claim to personally (in real life, not just online) know someone with an April LID and a referral and they are not SN and (see the list above). At this point I think we look at this one as a rumor that it has happened again. I’d like to hear from more sources before I give it a “yeah, this happened”.
October 13th, 2007 at 9:48 am
I would think if it was true, the people involved would be afraid to let people know. It would upset so many people before them. I know it wouldn’t be right but it gives me hope with an early 07 lid
October 13th, 2007 at 9:59 am
Bizarro! If it’s true, I hope we learn more. If it’s entire travel groups (typo for LID groups?) matched, it makes it hard to think they’d be selecting people “more worthy” out of the humungous pool of waiting parents. Weird!
October 13th, 2007 at 9:59 am
Wow, if true obviously a mix up. But, I also think they would be afraid to let people know they received their referrals that early. It certainly would be no fault of their own. This is strange though. Makes you wonder if things will get wacky like this or is it just a fluke mixup.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:10 am
Could this be the “Golden” agency, that has been talked about?
If the pap’s were that shocked, maybe not. I don’t begrudge them their referral. With a 3/24/06 LID, is it terrible to wish that it had been me? *shrug* :(
If it is true, I feel a little jealous, :(
October 13th, 2007 at 10:14 am
We are a late April 06 LID, the next LID group up for our agency is 12/12/05. The more I read about this and hear about it, the more angry it makes me. This weeks marks 2 years since we began our paperchase and to think that people that were standing in line along side us, suddenly just JUMPED to the head of the line, makes me want to scream. Last month I thought it was a fluke. Now, two months in a row…not so much a fluke anymore. At the rate our line is moving, it will be another 2 years before we get our referral. From inception of inquiring about adoption process to referral will almost be 5 years.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:14 am
Jensant - first bullet point from above “This is not the agency that received early referrals before.”
October 13th, 2007 at 10:18 am
Strange… but it gives hopes for people like me with March 2007 LIDs. But I would not understand why the CCAA would make such a change in their usual process. So strange… Let’s wait to have more info on that then…
October 13th, 2007 at 10:19 am
Duh! LOL, thanks for pointing that out! I am still having my morning coffee :)
October 13th, 2007 at 10:26 am
I hate those people. I would like to throw rotten tomatoes at them. Sorry, I just had to say that. I hope I don’t get banned forever.
12/05
October 13th, 2007 at 10:31 am
Things do not need to get ugly again. Take a step back and try (I know!) not to take it personally. It is not the fault of the people who got their referrals sooner, if it is true. They have as much control as we do and now feel that they are unable to share their happiness for fear of being rejected and yelled at. Come on it is the CCAA and maybe the agency not the people. Last time this got way out of hand.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:32 am
I don’t know how this gives people “hope” as some have mentioned. This is not normal and makes me wonder about what is going on.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:39 am
Curiouser and curiouser. I wonder what’s going on.
It sure would be nice if some of the lucky referral families were to contact the Queen and tell them what they know.
IMHO ANYTIME of the month is a great time to see babies! So come on people, let’s see ‘em!
October 13th, 2007 at 10:42 am
Well it gives me hope in the sense that if (and this is a big if) the CCAA is changing its process for the attribution of referrals (which I don’t know why they would do it), it means that they would be going randomly. So, because of that, this means we could get a referral earlier than what we are expecting or we could also get it later than expected. We have no control on that.
As for the people who seems to have been receiving their early referral, this would be a real surprise. So, I feel happy for them. Put yourself in their shoes, what would you do if something like that was happening to you? For sure I would not write anything on the forums… too sensitive subject.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:51 am
This is so lame and frustrating. It just seems so random. It’s like (but on a MUCH larger scale, I know) those years after college when my friends and I would go to the clubs and the bouncers would randomly choose certain girls to “skip the line.”
I wonder if those same bouncers are now working for the CCAA? I wish they would remember me from those days and give me the nod again–I’ve been waiting in this line for almost 22 months!!!!!
I swear, if someone I know tries to pass me up, I’m going to trip them! So unfair…
October 13th, 2007 at 10:53 am
Yippeee How exciting. Maybe it could happen to any of us…an earlier than expected referral.
I’m for one happy to see any babies faces at any time of the month, so if you are reading this all you new Mama’s and Baba’s please post to RQ so we can all help you celebrate.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:54 am
I’m really offended that people with a late LID, especially ‘07 would write that folks getting an early referral gives them hope. To me if sounds as if they are saying, “Yeah if people are jumping to the head of the line it gives me hope that I may be able to jump to the front of the line too and not wait like everyone else.” What happened to fairness? Or maybe poetic justice may be that the folks who feel that way would not get to jump to the front of the line and not only have to wait in this totally long and unreasonable line but would also get to watch many others jump ahead of them while their wait extends.
I think it is time for agencies to now get involved and find out what is happening. This affects the integrity of the whole program. I will be speaking to the owner of my agency on Monday. My husband is so angry and wants to contact the state department on Monday.
Great. Have a happy weekend everyone.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:54 am
It sounds like those people are shocked but personaly they could be happy considering all the times that have been floated out there. I know with our log in dat of this past march we have not even started to purchase and furnish for the baby and would be going into hyper drive to prep now. I spoke to a customer who’s cousin adopted from a mid western agency last year and he mentioned that they’re wait was shorter than the rest of the other groups . Does any one know if they have people who handle a certain agency and orphanges by them selves? This might be what’s hppening. each worker has thier own agency and orphanages to work on and some are better at the process than others in the office? Don’t know just throwing it out there> M
October 13th, 2007 at 10:58 am
I would definitely be happy for a surprise. But a reason for going with China is its predictability. Everyone is in a line and say with a 12/05/05 LID we can pretty much expect to be next. But if they handed out referrals willy nilly then I could never say I was next. Thus never knowing when I would get a referral. I liked the predictability of China’s program. and I believe a lot of other people did too. Life changes all the time and its nice to know about when you can expect a referral. Sending them randomly, in my opinion, is pure chaos.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:59 am
I am with you AL, I really can’t see how this can give people with LID in 06 or 07 hope for a faster referral, or even worse, referral out of line.
I am sure if this is true, it is a mistake. Also Chinese people make mistakes but I am really shocked about the reactions I read hear.
And sorry frannysmom, I understand you are frustraded about the long wait, we all are, but how can you hate these people? Like RQ wrote, it seems like they where surprised themselves. Imagine something like that would happen to you. I would be happy for you and maybe I felt sorry for myself, but I would absolutely not hate you for that or throw TOMATOS on you *LOL*.
I really think people have to calm down and face reality. Mistakes wil ALWAYS happen but that does NOT mean that we have to hate the fortuned ones and it does NOT mean to speculate that it will happen to you too.
Be nice and kind and realistic.
Have a nice weekend.
Beate
LID DEC 8, 2005
October 13th, 2007 at 10:59 am
like you pointed out rq, it could be a coincidence but i think the last bullet point is most interesting. it’s as if the ccaa is helping this agency ‘keep up appearences’ by allowing them to prove out their bogus wait time projection. but why? it’s probably a coincidence but its fishy nonetheless.
with a feb 06 LID i should be mad, but for some reason, this time i am not mad, just fascinated. lately, being part of this process is like watching a freak show
October 13th, 2007 at 11:00 am
Wow, now we are “hating” other pap’s who are receiving the most amazing news of their lives?
I am LID 2/6/06 and while I understand the frustration of this whole process and there are many days that I feel like the puppet on someone’s (CCAA) string - I am thrilled that these children are 1 day closer to a loving home…Even if it is not mine.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:01 am
jaclyn I do hope your weekend gets better.
Hope is what all of us cling to, and this just sparks a little bit more. I don’t think that the 07 LID people meant any offense by what they posted. I don’t know what your LID is, but I can honestly admit there is a little bit in me that is doing a Happy dance with the slightest thought that we might get a surprise, and there is a part of me that says this might not be very fair. The CCAA can do what they please and if it means changing the way they handle “the line” we all think we’re standing in so be it. This is a different agency as RQ has stated, which means the predictability might have just got a whole lot more interesting to say the least.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:03 am
I agree jggmom. I can understand a little jealousy and even envy, but hate is just plain irrational. I’m happy for these families.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:06 am
I would suspect it is the result purely of a mistake, just like happened to those poor 11/30 LID people, who I assume are still waiting. It has happened before right? It happened to a friend of mine about 8 years ago and of course I was delighted for her.
But just think if this were a trend, you could never even say “I am next.” That’s been pretty hard lately anyway.
By saying I hate those people, what I mean is that I think it is just so horrible for the people who’ve been waiting so much longer to feel like they have no idea when they will ever get their referrals. Of course I don’t really. It was a lame attempt at a joke. Not that I find anything about the situation very funny at the moment.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:09 am
I have no ill will towards anyone that may receive a surprise referral- as long as it is all ethical. If this is true, I think it is wonderful for those families. However, I am starting to worry that the CCAA may be shaking things up even more and the lack of control or possible planning is so far out of reach that it would drive a lot of people mad- myself included. I am so curious- what is going on? Hmmm…
5/06
October 13th, 2007 at 11:12 am
This looks like a good time to step back, have a seat and relax. In due time we will know if this is rumor or fact. If fact, then we simply ask our agencies what’s up. They either know or they don’t. Even if they know - it doesn’t mean they’ll tell us. Bottom line. We wait. Stay cool. No name calling. No freaking out about losing our place in line. Sure it’s hard. What hasn’t been hard about this journey?
Peace.
fm
October 13th, 2007 at 11:13 am
Let me 1st say this: I have mixed feelings.
1. I’m happy for those families.
2. Mad for everyone who has to wait close to 2 yrs., how unfair. UGH.
Now I’m going to say this & hope I don’t get scolded. For everyone ‘in line’ now: this makes the line a little shorter…
Have a good weekend.
Lisa.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:14 am
Perhaps it’s not about lines and order any more, not very nice for those who have been waiting>
October 13th, 2007 at 11:15 am
I don’t think I have much more to day than, Wow.
We’re March 06 06 and I have to say that if we got an early referral we would be screwed b/c we don’t have an up to date 171H, and our processing is about 3 months. I know that my agency has told me that I can wait until after the holidays to update. I’m guessing they are telling their Apr families even later since I’m early march and March is so big.
I guess the things I”m most curious about are: 1. Is everybody through Apr 06 referred for this agency 2. What happens to the families that aren’t for various reasons logistically ready for what (if they are truly surprised) is a referral about a year earlier than expected?
WTW (sorry, I know I broke a cardinal rule with 2 different log-ins)
October 13th, 2007 at 11:17 am
This may be way out there, but is it possible CCAA is taking a few agencies at a time, catching them up to an acceptable LID and referring out the rest of available babies?
October 13th, 2007 at 11:27 am
I think Frannysmom was being facetious.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:40 am
Hi,
I’m going to try this again. My 1st post didn’t get posted.
I have mixed feelings about this, if it is indeed true.
1. I’m happy for those April 2006 LID parents.
2. I’m also upset for those that have waited close to 2 yrs. and for those who will be waiting.
BUT, if this is true, this will make the “line” that much shorter.
Trying to stay positive…
Have a good weekend.
Lisa.
LID: 12.20.06
October 13th, 2007 at 11:46 am
For everyone ‘in line’ now: this makes the line a little shorter
********************************************
I don’t understand this rationale. If someone who had a LID date BEFORE me received a referral out of line, then yes, my line would be shorter because they would get a referral before me regardless. But someone who received an early referral with a LID date AFTER mine, then they just made my wait longer.
Many of the folks who replied with new LID dates don’t seem to care as much and neither would I. Why, because the people who received early referrals all had LID dates way before them and didn’t effect their wait times at all.
I would be interested to see their reaction if this post appeared 18 months later in April of ‘09 and they saw people with ‘08 LIDs receiving early referrals. I bet it would be very very very different.
Now I’m going to get ready for my party and try to salvage what is left of my birthday.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:48 am
waitingforkiera, interesting theory…can’t wait to see what happens in the near future. It could very well be that CCAA is trying to skp around and catch agencies up. They may be looking at the different numbers of families at each agency and making their judgement based on that? Who knows.
This sure is a roller coaster ride. We are going to add our names to the SN list this week. Wonder what list we will be matched with first?
October 13th, 2007 at 11:48 am
Thanks, Maysmom. With 12/05 LID and having been told by my agency that I probably won’t get a referral before xmas, I am just really discouraged. I should probably stop reading this site, it only seems to discourage me more. Every single month since our LID it seems that the wait we expected has gotten longer. I know, no one is entitled to a child. We are all lucky even to have the option of applying and waiting in line with 20,000 families. But kind of hard to feel lucky about that sometimes.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:54 am
Error? Mistake? Random????? I think not! I can see how maybe a December pile could be these things but an April of ‘06???? Get real!!!!!
There is nothing predicitable about this program anymore! SN getting referred in the NSN program, referrals out of order, etc!
As a 12/5/05 I am not even sure if we are next or if our agency will get another 33 referrals for SN babies again in November and we will have to wait another month! Don’t get me wrong I am thrilled that SN referrals came in but one batch of NSN would be nice too!
Adomom
October 13th, 2007 at 12:08 pm
eli wrote: “it’s as if the ccaa is helping this agency ‘keep up appearences’ by allowing them to prove out their bogus wait time projection. but why?”
eli, I wonder if the CCAA isn’t helping one or two agencies keep up their cash flow. Some of these smaller or mostly China agencies have got to be hurting. Many of them have had a relationship with the CCAA for over a decade–perhaps they were in a position to ask China for assistance in staying afloat.
Please note that this is purely conjecture on my part.
klem
October 13th, 2007 at 12:18 pm
adomom12, our agency better get referrals in November considering we are the next group. I don’t know what to do if 12/05 families don’t get referrals next.
And what about those 11/30 families? They were skipped but yet they matched some 4/06 LIDs? How crazy is that? I feel bad for myself (12/05 LID) not getting an October referral but I feel incredibly bad for those 11/30 families.
October 13th, 2007 at 12:19 pm
Is it possible that there was some problem with their LID? A large gap between DTC and LID due to lost paperwork? Maybe they worked things out and moved them up in the line without actually giving them a new LID based on when the paperwork should have been there? There could be so many innocent reasons for this happening. So many disturbing ones too! Without all the facts, we’ll never know. I know it’s easy to assume the worst when everyone has been waiting so long, but I just wanted give a different spin on things and wish those new parents all the best!
October 13th, 2007 at 12:20 pm
I agree with jaclyn and AL. As a 12/05′r with a very small agency, it seems incredibly disheartening to know that there is a possibility of being skipped over. Isn’t that what it is, being skipped? Why not take those referrals and clear out the smaller agencies in December and January? How unfair for those of us who will have to wait two years. What did I do to deserve a 24 month + wait while others only have to wait 18? Early December should be next, not April of 06. Personally, I can’t be happy for them when the friends I have made in my December & January groups are hurting so badly for their children.
Wendy
LID 12/27/05
October 13th, 2007 at 12:26 pm
There’s no question that as someone with an April ‘06 LID I’m jealous as all get out. Sure, I’m happy for them (and I’m secretly hoping it’s one of the wonderful people I’ve “met” online…I guess that knowing that these surprise referrals went to someone really nice would make me feel a little better for whatever reason). But this is strange.
RQ - I know you’re still at the information gathering stage, but is there anything that would indicate that all of the families who have received early referrals have something in common? Age, income, # of children, profession…anything? I’m not upset, just trying to wrap my brain around things. THANKS for all you do!
October 13th, 2007 at 12:29 pm
To the lucky April 06 referred parents congratulations! No one should begrudge them. I seriously doubt that any of them paid extra money or some other favor to speed the process so be happy for them.
As for me, if I was in this group I definitely would not go public! On the other hand I would confirm the situation with RQ. Those that know these families should try to get them to confirm with RQ.
As for CCAA/China I can only wonder in disbelief. Speaking of China’s International Adoption Program…think of a situation where you had the utmost respect for a person or organization and one day you find out that they are phony or do not deserve the respect or reputation they have obtain from yourself or others.
China’s International Adoption Program was built on its fairness and certainty…Follow the process and you get your adopted child in an orderly and timely fashion. All qualifying perspective parents were treated equal.
Now we have found this to be untrue so with uncertainty comes frustration and a certain amount of fear with that uncertainty.
I just want to get our little girl and be done with all of this!
June 06 LID
October 13th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
I hate to say it but the reality is that it is “their country…their rules”.
Over the last two years we all have been pretty frustrated, miserable, disappointed, etc. etc. And now I think it is kind of like finding out there is no Santa Claus.
At this point raising a stink about it is likely to accomplish little…other than maybe have China decide the program isn’t worth the trouble for them.
My opinion of course.
October 13th, 2007 at 1:04 pm
I am jumping in here, so I hope this is not repetitive of something that has already been covered, but due to the dates being mentioned, I thought I would throw it out there. Back in March, I met someone who was adopting their 2nd child from China (saying that to indicate she had gone through this before). We were talking about the long wait, etc… She said that with no explanation, their agency mailed their dossier to CCAA in November, but were given an April LID. She was of course very upset given the current wait times and the fact that her agency had no explanation. Could this somehow be what happened - confusion with the LID’s? I guess the only way to clarify that, would be to know the DTC of those who received their referrals with an April LID.
Reading Teacher
October 13th, 2007 at 1:12 pm
Happy for those families,
BUT with a March 06 LID the comment about the line getting shorter does not apply for me… just adds to my wait…
On the other hand I am VERY curious how many babies we are talking here… 2? 10? 20?
My agency reports only 15 families from Dec 1- March 22 (my LID)… it would be very easy to just knock them out in one month…
But that would not be fair… I chose China because it would be the path with the least grief…
October 13th, 2007 at 1:13 pm
Definitely it’s “their country…their rules”; can somebody please tell me what this week’s rules are??
October 13th, 2007 at 1:33 pm
Hay guys,
If it were you who received a referral so soon you would be overjoyed and would not appreciate people “HATING” you. I too dont agree with this but dont take it out on the PAP’s. THey are very lucky and no it is not right but it is NOT THEIR FAULT!!!
Christy :)
October 13th, 2007 at 1:34 pm
I am very happy for these babies. I think that there is some magic out there that matches the right babies with the right families. These children and parents have found each other earlier rather than later, and I’m glad that they are able to come home as soon as possible.
My LID is June 2006.
October 13th, 2007 at 1:45 pm
RQ,
Is it possible that this is a sign that the CCAA is going to start doing referrals a little differently?
Perhaps they will tell the agencies about it at the annual meeting (isn’t there typically an annual meeting in December?)?
OR
Could this be a sign that the CCAA is matching past the referrals dates they issue and sitting on the referrals for a while– only letting so many out at a time? The mailing of these referrals was a mistake by someone?
Even if they didn’t have enough babies to make it to Dec 5th this past batch, April 2006 for one agency seems like a lot of referrals to jump ahead! Maybe it is a small agency with only a few clients?
I am happy for these people, and of course the babies– they get thier family. . . But,
this also makes me want to go to the cussing thread and drop some bombs.
LID 12/20/05– when is it ever going to be my turn?
October 13th, 2007 at 1:45 pm
All I know is that I am very confused.
It’s like standing in line at a popular night club and you can’t get in because the club is at capacity, but you have to watch helplessly as someone who came after you, is allowed in, with no explanation of why.
(poor analogy I know, but it’s all I could think of)
I have not animosity towards the April folks that got referrals, this is a very happy time for them, children in need of a loving home, now have it. It’s just I wish the rest of us would get a break too.
I am kinda hoping that ReadingTeacher is right and that it has to do with mixed up LIDS, that CCAA is trying to make right.
October 13th, 2007 at 2:18 pm
I am now leeting out a big, fat, dramatic >>. I no longer know what to think about any if this. What ever happened to predictability? So discouraging …
October 13th, 2007 at 2:20 pm
I meant to say letting out a big, fat, dramatic >>. I can no longer even post correctly. Oh well …
October 13th, 2007 at 2:20 pm
… sigh …
October 13th, 2007 at 2:23 pm
Happy for them…..Stinks for the rest of us.
October 13th, 2007 at 2:41 pm
Am I the only one NOT being confused and surprised? I think that things like this probably have happened before too, we just have better ways to find out now. My theory is that this is about small agencies (I’d guess there are more of them, though I don’t think this is a big thing if we talk about numbers of referrals) who have very very long periods with no referrals at all because of the slow down, and the CCAA just chose to help them by some reason. I never expected the CCAA to be fair, I’m not sure they ever have been and I don’t think they have promised anyone to be so either.
But, as someone above mentioned, this probably feels a lot different for those of us logged in -07. Nobody jumped ahead of us yet. And I think many of us have from the beginning of our paper chasing process thought that we’ll have to wait approximately 1.5-6 years. Many of us just don’t have a clue and we never had and never expected to be able to have. Those of you who are LID from dec 05 up to april 06 are in a very different situation, waiting times being about quadrupled or more for you. So I won’t say I wouldn’t have been surprised and also very angry if I was in the same situation.
I’d just like to know if there is anyone else out there who never even counted on that there will be a baby for you in the end? I always had the feeling that anything could happen. Having payed lots of money and invested very much emotionally through the HS and so on, I still never thought that China “must” give me a baby in the end. You just never know. I’m just curious: Is there anyone else out there who went into this with the same feelings?
October 13th, 2007 at 2:59 pm
Klem, Aunt2be and ReadingTeacher - I believe any of those reasons you are suggesting might very well be the case her. We don’t know the reason for this bunch of referrals, but I am sure there is an explanation. Let us not jump to negative conclusions.
Congratulations to the families that received their unexpected referral!
October 13th, 2007 at 2:59 pm
Not that this had anything to do with the group who got refferals, but the way things are going who knows? The national congress is meeting for the first time since 2002. crack downs on dididents , extreme house keeping on all the public places in Bejing, politcal house cleaning of corupt individuals. What effect does this have on the minstries ? I wonder if there is about to be a flurry of reviews and refferals now?
October 13th, 2007 at 3:08 pm
As has been said, there could be a logical reason for this. The only one that really really makes sense to me right now is a LID foul up, and if that is what happened then I’m happy to see the CCAA make things right. I would think that if this is what happened, though, that the people with referrals would be telling that part of the story… wouldn’t ya’ll?
I wish I had answers, but I don’t.
Please, be nice to each other.
October 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm
“I wanted to try to verify it, which I have still not been able to do. ”
That is the key point in this issue, a rumor, nothing more, no matter how detailed it appears to be. Anyone can start a false rumor which will quickly propagate across the boards, and with repetition gets slightly changed and soon there appears to be several sources with the similar but independent information.
The “helping out small agencies” idea chills me to the bone. So what if they don’t have any LID’s for several months, they’ve got the bulk of their fees up front anyway! Just because it’s a small agency does not mean their clients should benefit. Preferential treatment is the fastest way to destroy the integrity of the China program. Especially if this rumor has any merit, referring so far out of order (most of a year?) will certainly have long reaching implications. If it has happened, that’s great for them, but really sucks for the rest of us. If it has happened, I, with a Jan ‘06 LID will feel very resentful unless I hear a legitimate explanation. If we were referred that far out of order, we would be very, very quiet about it!
My take on it bounces between two opinions - A) Totally Bogus, and B) A paperwork problem that gives a misleading LID
October 13th, 2007 at 4:04 pm
LuckyMommy Says:
“I think that there is some magic out there that matches the right babies with the right families.”
I know that this is contrary to the opinion of many, but
I believe that the magic of the matching/adoption is the ability to love any child placed in our arms and the love that develops between parent and child, not the actual matching.
Shanggirls
October 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pm
Strange…? What is going on?
I wish I could congraulate these surprise new parents… but before that, I would like to know that everything has been handled “by the book”. To me, surprises like this often come with a price tag on it…… But maybe I am just being paranoid from waiting in this line for to long….
BTW isn’t it strange that it is only April LIDs involved? No early January, March or May LIDs for example? What’s up with April-06?
October 13th, 2007 at 4:33 pm
“BTW isn’t it strange that it is only April LIDs involved? No early January, March or May LIDs for example? What’s up with April-06?”
Maybe nothing more than that this particular agency didn’t have any LID group until then.
RQ, could you R-rate this one?
October 13th, 2007 at 4:39 pm
Those of us who are next, would like to be next. After waiting going on 23 months this kind of news is discouraging to those of us who have been waiting the longest. Yes, it’s a nice “surprise” for the April 06 families, but to jump 5 months ahead, what kind of “mistake” is that? This has probably shortened their wait by one year and what about our Nov 05 group that was missed? Something stinks here. Disappointed yet again.
October 13th, 2007 at 5:05 pm
Has anyone else seen this discussed on any other boards? We are LID April ‘06 and never heard a thing on the April ‘06 Yahoo Group, just wondering where else this may have been talked about.
October 13th, 2007 at 5:17 pm
Mamman,
This was another agency than the one mentioned before, and if I am not mistaken the last one also received early referrals for April-06 LID groups.
Ok, both of them may not have any LID groups between Nov-05 and April-06, but still, why are these agencies, with next LID of April-06, the only ones getting early surprise(?) referrals?
???
October 13th, 2007 at 5:26 pm
I wonder, if the CCAA finds whole groups that meet the new (post May 2007) criteria whether it will give those groups priority. I did think it was odd at the time to say that people who meet the new criteria will have priority rather than saying that those are the criteria to meet to adopt from China. I realize the CCAA has said several times that it is only applying the new rules prospectively, but taking certain groups out of order doesn’t seem entirely inconsistent with that idea to me. Also has the CCAA ever stated that it will only refer children to PAPs in accordance with their LID order? I am not sure why people feel so strongly that LID order must be followed, except that it does seem fundamentally fair to do it that way.
October 13th, 2007 at 5:31 pm
I don’t know how anyone could possibly find this hopeful. I find it terrifying. We have an 07 LID. If the CCAA makes a habit of this, then statistically our chances of being one of the lucky few are extremely small, but if other people do skip the line, the ALL of us who got skipped will be in for a longer wait. How on earth does this offer anyone hope?
October 13th, 2007 at 5:35 pm
Guangdong:
I don’t think it would be such a bad thing if the CCAA was trying to help out smaller agencies–or at least it is not the worst reason out there.
But you are right that my comment was not based anything other than my own speculation, and I wouldn’t want anyone take it for anything other than that.
klem
October 13th, 2007 at 5:48 pm
…..”WELL. YOU KNOW WHAT THEY SAY..HE WHO HAS THE GOLD MAKES THE RULES…” IT IS UPSETTING, HUMILIATING FOR THOSE OF US…WHO STILL ARE WAITING TO HEAR SUCH NEWS..HOWEVER, THERE IS LITTLE WE CAN DO, BUT HOPE AND PRAY THIS NIGHTMARE WILL BE OVER FOR ALL SOON…..
LID MARCH 17, 2006
October 13th, 2007 at 5:51 pm
………you know what they say he who has the gold makes the rules….not much we can do, but hope this nightmare is over soon…..I’ll keep praying…
LID March 17,2006….
October 13th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
Hello :o) I have a question regarding this statement my klem - I wonder if the CCAA isn’t helping one or two agencies keep up their cash flow. Some of these smaller or mostly China agencies have got to be hurting
What is meant by this? I often wonder about the exchange of monies between the Agencies and The CCAA and wonder how that works? In my last 2 adoptions and in my current one (All SN’s) I felt as if my 2 agencies have “put me on the back burner” so to speak once I paid them all their fees, assuming there was nothing it in monetarily for them, but maybe I am incorrect? Thank you.
Also for the line analagy, just because the ones ahead of you have gotten their referrals, it does not mean the line is shorter. There are always people to take their place. My fear is that my file is in the wrong pile (for LOA/TA) or fell behind someone’s desk.
October 13th, 2007 at 6:08 pm
If I were one of the lucky people, I would be totally open in announcing my referral. I would also say–facetiously of course–go ahead, hate me, I would hate me too, but you should know we did nothing unethical and are just lucky. No one is really hating anyone here, no one is really begrudging anyone anything (as long as things were handled ethically and I presume that was the case if the families were shocked to get their referrals). But I would be open with the information out of concern for the adoption community in general, for the other waiting families. Even if it is still a mystery why they got their referrals when they did, some of the questions could be answered.
October 13th, 2007 at 6:11 pm
Well, surprisingly……..this makes me happy. That means there could be a speck of hope that we will have our child before 2009.
J
LID: April 11, 2006
October 13th, 2007 at 6:21 pm
Rumor Queen,
Is it possible that all these early referrals are to families who fit the New Requirements? When this thought accured to me I was horrified because my husband and I are too old under the New Rules even though we have been logged in since
June 2, 2006
October 13th, 2007 at 6:21 pm
I’m with a big China-only agency that used to have 50-100 applications for some of its waiting children. I’ve witnessed the ugliness toward those parents who did get chosen for that list, so I can’t say I blame *these* parents a bit for not coming forth.
Yes, it would be great if they would anonymously let RQ know the run-down; however, if this is a small agency and the agency has requested that no one say anything, chances are that their agency would know from whom verification of the rumors came.
October 13th, 2007 at 6:21 pm
I asked my agency about this. They called CCAA and questioned them. My understanding is that CCAA told them it was none of their business.
October 13th, 2007 at 6:33 pm
I agree that the ‘magic’ is the love of a parent. Once they place that child in your arms you are going to love them. No matter who she/he is….and no matter when the referral comes.
October 13th, 2007 at 6:46 pm
Everyone might want to consider that there are entities that might gain from getting all of us in these online frenzies. Some rumors might be created to feed the creator! Just food for thought, pun intended. :o(
October 13th, 2007 at 7:02 pm
If what wickedwitcheast says is accurate then the rules of this game have changed. Quote: “I asked my agency about this. They called CCAA and questioned them. My understanding is that CCAA told them it was none of their business.”
That statement is real sucker punch to the gut of waiting families.
October 13th, 2007 at 7:06 pm
This does stink. I often believe the “squeeky wheel gets the grease”, but I think we need to calm down. To me, it seems, the CCAA knows we are getting upset. Therefore the slow down, now referring out of line. Is this all to try to get our goat and make us angrier? Is it making them happy to create caos with us all? I am thinking so. They have us in the palm of their hands. I don’t think we should rock the boat. It will only make them more spiteful. I wholeheartedly felt China was the best program in January of 2006. I am having a hard time, these days, trusting in them. IMO, the program is going to “HE double toothpicks” in a hand basket.
October 13th, 2007 at 7:14 pm
WHOA! “None of their business” No, I guess it is not. I sure hope my agency doesn’t call them and inquire. I would hate to hear that the agency, that called, was a big one and now their few hundred people in line will get pushed back even further for ticking them off.
October 13th, 2007 at 7:38 pm
If some families got early referrals without any advanced knowledge or “special” contributions or relationships, then I am happy for them. They had no control over what happened. A part of me is sad that they may feel frightened to announce or post their happy news.
At the same time, I am more worried than ever. We have waited 21 months with a possible 6 more months to go (LID
1/06). When we filed our paperwork the wait was 6 months TOTAL. Our hope for a second child is all but lost at this time, we will age out. While we have been in this line, we have aged out of other countries programs.
My hope for even one child is being replaced with fear, what will happen next? Will we be passed up, will we be skipped?
So, no one promised us a child, no one guaranteed that we would be in a predictable orderly wait, no one said China plays fair. But we had the impression that all these were true. We choose China for it’s predictability, stability, fairly reasonable guidelines, and relatively good ethics. All this is a thing of the past.
As much as we are suffering, the children of China will be the ones who will ultimately lose. Less children allowed out of the country, less families willing to commit to the unknowns.
October 13th, 2007 at 7:39 pm
This might be stupid, but is it possible these “small” agencies have notified the CCAA they want to go out of business because of the wait and the CCAA is helping them to get rid of the few families they still have waiting so they can close? Just a thought I can’t think of anything else that would make sense.
I am happy for the famiies getting their babies, but this is just wretched for the rest of us still waiting!
Michele
LID 08/29/06
October 13th, 2007 at 7:48 pm
I do not believe any of this. Again, I believe they are just rumors. I also can’t believe an agency would call them directly over something like this. Why not ask them something more productive, like is there ever going to be a speed up? What’s the referral cut off for this month, etc? This is just to odd. I don’t believe it until I see it.
October 13th, 2007 at 8:38 pm
I have to say that this doesn’t surprise me. Some of the people at CCAA must have personal relationships with one or more agencies out there and favor them now and then for reasons we’ll never know. And I’m sure I’ll get flamed for saying this, but it’s kind of human nature to help those you know first–if an agency CCAA knows well makes a compelling case for moving a group up, why wouldn’t they help out a friend if they were in a position to do so?
It could also just be a mistake. Either way, I say, lucky parents, lucky babies. I wish them all well, even as I wish I wasn’t looking at such a long wait myself (I also have an April ‘06 LID).
Somebody here asked if anyone else went into this not counting on a baby at the end–we did, and even felt the same way when we adopted our first child from China three years ago. Maybe it’s because our agency (which is disappointing on the communication end of things these days) does do a very good job preparing prospective parents for all potential scenarios, including the fact that there is no guarantee of a baby in IA. China doesn’t owe us her children, much as we all want to parent them. That said, I do believe that they will provide a referral to everyone who is logged in–it would be out of character for the Chinese to back out of an agreement.
October 13th, 2007 at 8:47 pm
Woa. Let me put the brakes on here a minute.
I don’t even know what to think now.
I’m just SO ready for there to be some concrete facts to come out of the CCAA so we can quit speculating and get some real answers. My first question I’d like an answer to: “What is going on here?”
I’m tired of being in the dark about everything as far as from my agency, etc., even though I know they don’t have anything substantive to share.
I mean I’m not only ready for some news, any news, but GOOD news for a change.
October 13th, 2007 at 8:56 pm
As a waiting family, who is LID in May, their agencies next LID in fact and who meets and exceeds all of the new rules… I would be surprised if that is the way these are happening… we would have long ago received our referral.
Our agencies last date was in the batch several months ago.
I find it hard to believe it’s a ‘mistake’, rather I wonder if there’s a new ‘preference’ that’s not entirely understood at this time.
Perhaps the “ignorance is bliss” of years ago might have served better now? Perhaps not.
I wish the families who (may have) received early referrals all the best. I wish my own family an end to the childless chasm in our souls.
October 13th, 2007 at 9:39 pm
Let’s be careful how we react and respond. Remember that any bad press about adopting from China affects us negatively. We do not wants things to slow even further or worse, stop. All we can do is pray for a speed up, hang in there, or switch to another country. I know it is terrible. I am living it too. But there is nothing else we can do. Just send out those positive vibes! T
LID 7-28-07
October 13th, 2007 at 9:56 pm
I am with a big agency. I called a week ago about updating paperwork. I asked specifically about this point. They said that they called and that the CCAA told them to basically butt out.
Call your own agencies if you care.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:03 pm
Klem, I know your post was just speculation, but I think it’s a good hypothesis.
All of this worries me a little, but I’m keeping myself from coming to any conclusions until we hear the reasons. I do think we deserve to hear more.
If any of the early LID’ers are out there… please PM RQ.
Thanks.
October 13th, 2007 at 10:43 pm
I have a REALLY hard time believing that the CCAA would tell an agency to “butt out” and “it’s none of your business” That does not sound like proper Chinese culture or face saving talk at all!
October 13th, 2007 at 10:44 pm
Two agencies have contacted CCAA as per posts above and two have been told ” none of your business” in one way or another. Is there any others that know of their agencies making enquiries re the early referrals last month to be told the same thing.
The “fair” China programme may no longer exist? Or is it with such a growing adoption community these things have been happening before but now surfacing due to our network?
October 13th, 2007 at 10:46 pm
First of all, it’s a rumor.
But even if it’s true, so what? It might have been done for valid reasons. And if not, again, so what? Who’s to say this type of thing hasn’t occurred dozens of times throughout the 15 years the CCAA has been operating? And if it has, again, so what? It’s their business. They’ll do what they deem necessary, or best, or whatever.
Nji13 has an excellent post in the forum (General Discussion). You might want to check it out.
Also, a Nov. 30 family has posted that they’ve just received their referral. This is one of the families who was missed last week. Seems to me CCAA works very hard to rectify mistakes in a timely manner. Kudos to them.
China4
October 13th, 2007 at 10:49 pm
Speak of the devil - my spam word is CCAA-
This sure hasn’t been the experience we were hoping for when we started this way back in August 2005.
(Just in case CCAA is reading this)
CCAA- YOU GUYS ARE AWESOME- KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK-WE LOVE IT WHEN YOU KEEP US GUESSING-WE LOVE YOU GUYS !!!
October 13th, 2007 at 10:55 pm
Yeah, I agree with Military Brat, I just want something, some type of info confirming this.
Hann23
October 13th, 2007 at 11:01 pm
mzmerz- First I laughed- then I actually felt sick to my stomach when I read your comment about the fear you have of your paperwork being in the wrong pile or lost behind a desk somewhere.
I never thought of that scenario before.
October 13th, 2007 at 11:02 pm
I can’t believe anyone thinks the CCAA really reads this site! RQ has said that many times the CCAA has much to worry about and this site is just a very small blip on a HUGE radar screen!!!!! Much inflated egos around here to think the CCAA reads our thoughts and cares what we think!
October 13th, 2007 at 11:06 pm
I would assume that “butt out” was an interpretation of what was said by the official?!?!
Personally, I’m feeling a bit sick. Everything I was told about an upstanding, predictable, fair system is down the toilet.
And I’m with a small agency. Usually no more than one batch (8-12 families), every 2-3 months. And, at 12/14/05, we’re still here. So, we’re small…very small…
I just want a child. I play by the rules, I take time to learn Mandarin, the culture, heck, to vacation there…I chose China because my grandfather always taught me to respect their culture. What more can I do?
October 13th, 2007 at 11:07 pm
reminds me of a line in a movie….”ok folks…move along…there is noth’in more to see here.”
I am not chewing on this until the facts come out…moving on.
Congratulations to those families who did receive their referrals early who feel they can not share because of fear we may want to haze them. No matter what the reason…you have your child…and that is a good thing!
To those that got passed up…what is there to say….sorry doesn’t near cut it I know…but I am sorry nonetheless.
~Linda
October 13th, 2007 at 11:22 pm
I haven’t read all of the response’s, so forgive me if this has been written about. But I am wondering if CCAA really is changing how it does things-in order to try and rush the line along a bit. Everyone stays in the same LID order unless they fit all the new regulations…I know those don’t apply to those logged in…but what if first priority will be given to those families?? I mean paperwork has been checked already-so maybe if you fit the requirements you get slid into a new stack?
Just seems odd that this is the SECOND instance of the this happening in what-2 months of time?! Of course according to the source it is an entire LID group, so unless they ALL meet those requirements…that theory is shot out of the water.
Anyway, what I think is good about this is that say CCAA decides to start sending out NSN referrals 2 or more times during a month, including regular referrals? Wouldn’t that cause a larger “batch” depending on the steady flow of it? And help to speed up this long line inch by inch?
I would be THRILLED to get a referral in say 6 months with a LID of Aug. 16, 2006!!! That would be a great thing to me! Congrats to all the new parents! And for those of you really angry about this-I think this will become a standard thing and YOU may be next! Willing to pass your referral on to the person who didn’t get a referral? I bet they will take it!!
October 13th, 2007 at 11:39 pm
I know this is really hard for everyone and not very fair to those waiting we should never take it out on the families - it is not their fault. We can’t control things and the CCAA on the whole seem to to an amazing job and lets give them the benefit of doubt on this one that it was a mistake.
I know alot of US families think a wait of 2 years or possibly 3 is unbearable but just think of people in other countries that don’t have the great system you do and who have long waits - took me 5 years and 5 days before I got my darling girl but you know what if I had to do over again I wouldn’t change a thing as I wouldn’t have my daughter. (2 other couples in my batch had 5 & & year wait!)
To the April families - a big congraulations - once you are over the shock enjoy the time and good luck with getting everything ready in time…….
October 14th, 2007 at 12:00 am
RQ,
Did you get the impression that the agencies alerted to the last “Golden Agency” situation were outraged or even surprised ? Or was it more likely that they were already aware of the practice of favortism and only “objecting” to make a good show for their clients? Do they take issue with this inconsistacy on the part of the CCAA or are they resolved to it?
I guess what I’m getting at is this, is the perception that the CCAA is fair, honest and consistant in their dealings with PAP’s a myth that the agencies have helped maintain to their own benefit?
These are very jaded questions, but with an ‘07 LID I’m still not over the shock of how loosely the Agencies play with the truth about wait times. Call it semantics or lies, but this was the most important decision of our lives and the person we engaged to provide guidance failed us. I wonder if there are other myths that they are encouraging.
October 14th, 2007 at 12:22 am
We are March 2006 LID and received our referral yesterday for NSN. We moved to China exactly 1 year ago so were expedited due to this rule of the CCAA’s. Maybe these others are in the same situation? There are hundreds of waiting families who are expats living in China. Just a thought though I have no info to back this up.
October 14th, 2007 at 12:26 am
Okay, been away from the computer, and it’s late here, too late to totally process this information (12:262 am).
Here’s what confuses me……. I have a March ‘06 lid, and my agency has about three groups logged in before me.
I would think that this April ‘06 group, would have people that are due, or in line ahead of them, and they skipped over those people??? If that was the case, and I was one of the groups patiently waiting ahead of them, in the same agency, I’d have a HUGE problem with that.
I’d probably have a huge problem with that, if we were the ones to suddenly be surprised with an unexpected referral……. how can this be…….
I think that it’s sad for us, but a Miracle for these people.
I’m going to sleep on this……… just seems so cruel.
AND, my anti-spam word……. baby…….. where’s mine?
October 14th, 2007 at 12:29 am
I wonder how big the LID group was. Maybe this month referrals(numbers wise) was better than we thought??!
What do you think? Look at it this way. That is that many more NSN referrals ahead of us(those later than April 2006) that are out of the way. As for those of you whose LID is before this and you have already waited over 18 months yourselves; well, it sucks!
October 14th, 2007 at 12:42 am
We are March 2006 and received our referral yesterday for NSN. We moved to China exactly 1 year ago and were expedited due to this rule of the CCAA’s. Hundreds of families just like mine are expats living in China, adopting and most use the same agency. Therefore, this agency would get early referrals for their “in China” families. Just a thought.
October 14th, 2007 at 12:43 am
Wicked Witch is correct….. this is true
it was not in relation to early referrals………but rather the “golden agency” getting quick referrals
October 14th, 2007 at 12:49 am
***sorry if this is duplicate or triplicate***my posts not showing
We are March 2006 LID and got our NSN referral yesterday. We moved to China 1 yr ago and were expedited due to this rule of the CCAA’s. Hundreds of expats living in China and adopting just like us mostly use the same agency. So to me it would make sense that that agency would be getting all their early referrals due to the fact their clients live in China. Just my thought.
October 14th, 2007 at 6:47 am
The “helping out a small agency” hypothesis doesn’t make sense to me. If small agencies are in trouble now, they are still going to be in trouble in 3 months, 6 months etc. Unless the CCAA’s plan is to push all their referrals through.
Also, it seems to me that it is the larger China only agencies that are really hurting, 1000s of waiting families to manage, but no new $$ coming in. And I know that some of them have “stepped up” their SN program as a result, and that is keeping them afloat, but then you would think that they would be rewarded, not punished.
And isn’t it some of the biggest agencies that are the most established and do the most charity work in China?
I guess I’m just not understanding the small agency hypothesis. The he’s got a brother, whose cousin, whose daughter etc etc I get, but not the small agency.
And when agencies shut down I thought historically that all of those families were moved to another agency, they weren’t given automatic referrals.
WTW
October 14th, 2007 at 7:43 am
IT’S NOT FAIR!
My mom used to always say that “Life’s not fair.” Well, it’s not. With a 2/17/06 LID, I just want to say it one more time….it’s not fair!
October 14th, 2007 at 8:13 am
Congratulations to those that got lucky on getting a referral!
there are some things I have no control of.
all I know is that in 2 weeks I’m going on vacation , and expect to see referrals for the month of December!
May we get better news for the month of Dec. 2006!
patience is virtue will be my mantra until the new year gets here!antispam word :family! yup! that is what I will do for christmas , visit my family! :D
October 14th, 2007 at 9:21 am
RQ - Could you tell me if this is an American or a Canadian agency??
October 14th, 2007 at 9:24 am
Beijingkelly, congratulations on your referral! And thanks so much for adding your information to this site.
October 14th, 2007 at 9:30 am
Boy would it freak me out to get an early referral. It would be fantastic, but so much for planning. I don’t plan to tell my company until I think I am about 6 months away but if I had to suddenly leave, so be it. I would be worried about not qualifying for FMLA until March. With a pending acquisition of my company, my job would be in jeopardy.
Well, I think there can be many reasons why and we won’t know the answer, so we deal with it. I was shocked to read this, but I don’t feel like things are any less stable than I did a few days ago. I guess I was already jaded. I think I have also accepted that there is no guarantee.
Congratulations to those families if it is true I would probably keep it quiet as well because reactions can be so odd.
October 14th, 2007 at 9:32 am
We do not know if this is true or fiction so we are spinning ourselves up without knowing the facts. If it is true, then those that received referrals should be able to celebrate and post freely as they finally have their babies coming home. I wonder how many of us if we received a referral out of date would stand up and say, “oh no, that’s not fair to others†and not accept the referral. Life is not fair, and the sooner we accept that, the easier life becomes. We were logged in 9/06 and know we have a long time to wait, but we already love our daughter and are willing to wait. I know this is not easy but life does not come with guarantees so we just try to make the best of each day and enjoy our lives as just the two of us and look forward to having our baby girl home at some point. Hang in there and keep leaning on each other we will all make it through.
October 14th, 2007 at 10:00 am
asked my agency about this. They called CCAA and questioned them. My understanding is that CCAA told them it was none of their business.
*****************************************
Many people (myself included) interpreted this to mean CCAA doesn’t care and will not do anything about it. My husabnd on the other hand interpreted this differently. Knowing how China is about saving face and how they want to take care of their own problems quickly and quietly, he took this to mean that China will handle their in-house problem, quickly, quietly and severely. That is how they responded to the Hunan scandal and that is how they responded recently to the Mattell debacle. They have already executed a person over that. Can you imagine in the US? The person would have been forced to resign and would have left the company with a couple of million dollars in pension benefits!!!
Anyway, I just thought I’d throw that out there. One way to interpret their response is they want this quiet and will deal with it themselves quickly and severely. I know 2 people said their China only large agencies called CCAA and I can tell you my mid sized agency who handles adoptions from other countries as well, also called CCAA. They were told there was no agency receiving early referrals and were told not to worry about it. I was actually hoping it would have been handled through COA and/or state department rather than ccaa because of their past record of dealing so severely with people who break rules. I hate to think that someone could be executed over this because of a few greedy agencies who do not want to play by the rules and wait in line like the rest of us. If there are special favors given to certain agencies at least CCAA knows about it they know we know about it and they know agencies know about it.
I have more faith in CCAA doing the right thing than I do about COA, state department or any other agencies. Afterall, that is why I chose China in the first place. They have a record of being fair (unlike our system) and I have faith CCAA will handle it in their own way. Afterall, they didn’t even give Meg Ryan a special favor. Meg Ryan!!! Why would they give some Joe Schmo from Iowa a favor (risking their program, reputation and in China their life)?
If people are doing wrong, and the information is out there, I believe it will eventually catch up to the agencies and all who are involved.
October 14th, 2007 at 10:09 am
I also would like to know if this is a North American agency. I would feel much better about it if it was a European agency where PAPs go through years of pre-adoption process before even getting to submit paperwork to China.
One other point, is that if a LID group can out of the blue receive a batch of referrals months early, what’s to say we won’t get to a point where a LID group can out of the blue receive a batch of referrals months late?
If it’s true that CCAA ‘frowns’ on concurrent adoptions but just hasn’t issued a policy, this is one way to scare the pants off of people to keep them from doing it! I just started a concurrent, and while I am dying for my China adoption, since it was somewhat predictably far in the future, it was worth it to me to start the concurrent adoption now. I always liked how things worked in LID order, if nothing else people could plan their lives. Now it looks like even that might be taken away. And what about agencies having different policies of whether paperwork (hs, immigration) has to be current while you wait…an early referral could put a lot of people in a scramble. As much as I and everyone else hate the long wait, to me it’s better to be long and fair than for some people to wait months less than others.
I’m becoming less and less optimistic that our China adoption will ever happen. I just feel like the whole program might collapse. I hope not, but I definitely don’t feel like it’s the sure thing that I thought it was the first two times I went through the process.
October 14th, 2007 at 10:14 am
If this is not a rumor the only things that makes sense to me is that the CCAA has found an error and is correcting it such as LIDs that came way too late or something to that. Or the refferal work flow business rules have changed in which case we will surely hear more from our agencies. These are the only two things that make sense to me given that the CCAA holds themselves accountable to strick standards.
October 14th, 2007 at 12:31 pm
I wonder if there may be some legitimate logistical and practical reasons for the CCAA doing this. My understanding is that they are not only trying to match families with available children, but are trying to keep groups of applicants from the same agency together. This helps the agencies when hiring translators, facilitators, etc. Consider this scenario: Suppose orphanage X has 10 children available for placement and suppose that for practical reasons they want to place all 10 children at the same time. After matching families through a certain cut-off date, they still have 3 children from orphanage X who have not been placed. Wouldn’t it make sense that they would just take the next 3 applicants in line from the agency that already has applicants traveling to orphanage X to adopt the other 7 children rather than going in strict numerical order from the big list and involving 1 - 3 additional agencies? The CCAA could balance things out in later batches by not giving the agency that got the surprise referrals any more until the rest of the list had caught up.
October 14th, 2007 at 12:43 pm
I don’t blame the families who received referrals either. What is really upsetting to me is everyone with an LID around or after April 2006 who feel happy or excited that things might be quicker for them. That is such a slap in the face to all of those who have been waiting painstakingly for so long. Dreaming of their child, of creating their families, only to have others focus on ME, ME, & ME. This is so incredibly pathetic to me. I agree with jaclyn, if the tables were turned how would you feel? Hopefully, we are only a couple of weeks from referrals and December 2005 will get some good news. I am here rooting for you!!
LID 11/22/05 DOR 09/04/07 Leaving for China 11/25
October 14th, 2007 at 2:24 pm
It’s interesting that this is specifically April 2006, which was also the month that was in Review forever… I wonder if there could be any connection?
Also, a few people have made reference to the “two” posters whose agencies asked about this and were told it was none of their business; the way I understood it, that was wickedwitcheast who posted twice. Not that I don’t believe her, of course… but just keep in mind that, as far as we know, only ONE person has asked so far and only ONE agency has said the CCAA told them to mind their own business. I might try asking on Monday, too, although because I’m with a large China-only agency, WWE and I may be with the same one.
October 14th, 2007 at 2:33 pm
3xwait, glad to hear that you don’t feel so bad if it were a European agency ! We are “celebrating” our 5th Anniversary next week of starting the IA process. Once we started the process we had to wait 2 and a half years before we could commence our adoption course and homestudy. With an LID of early May 06, we more than likely will still be waiting a long time. Patience is a virtue …
October 14th, 2007 at 3:05 pm
If these April ‘06 LIDs just received their referrals, how can they be planning to travel in November (as per RQ’s original post)? Have TAs already been received for October referrals? (I’m still wondering if this is a false rumor.)
October 14th, 2007 at 6:17 pm
mingliang-
Yeah, but there’s a LOT of other agencies with people who have been waiting much much longer who could easily fill that need for 3 sets of parents in your scenario. To go that far ahead seems to be a bit contrary to “it makes it easier.” I think it would be harder to find an agency’s dossiers 4 months ahead than to just take the next batch of 3 families in the pile, but that’s my 2 cents.
And if CCAA did it that way on a regular basis, I think that there would be no belief in the “they go in order thing” cause it would happen all the time.
My big questions are:
1. Is this an LID screwup put right or
2. Is this agency referred up to 04/06, and if so, are they consistantly ahead.
October 14th, 2007 at 8:28 pm
Even if sending the referrals was intentional, I never thought there was any foul play or that this involved money changing hands. I figure it is just a favor between CCAA and an agency that has a good relationship. Here’s a very crude example…I used to work for a company in a business capacity. I later moved into tech support and worked on help desk calls. Normally, help desk calls were logged and assigned priority and went through certain channels to be resolved. Sometimes people who I used to work with knew me well enough and called me directly instead of going through the help desk. I took their call and usually fixed their problem on the spot, then after the fact filled out the help desk request and marked it complete. I guess technically I was bumping them ahead of the line because they knew me. I sort of figure the early referrals is this kind of relationship. We have much bigger problems if there would actually money changing hands, but I refuse to believe that unless it’s an R6! :)
October 14th, 2007 at 9:02 pm
Congratulations to all the families that received an early referral. (if this can possible be true). It is really sad for all the other families that feel like they have been waiting in line for all these months and now have just been skipped over…That is exactly how i would feel. I am LID 8/10/06, so it would be ok for me even, but still not fair…
sophismom
October 14th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
Well I was having a pretty good weekend. I would llike to know how this rumor started and how it was worded. Let me guess I know someone yet unnamed that knows someone who knows someones sister brothers wife who is lid april 06. The only other thing I can come up with is they have met all hague requirements and are certified. Do you know how many people I have heard had died then two weeks later they walked in the door at work? If I sound skeptical its because I am.
October 14th, 2007 at 10:59 pm
As alot have said, congrats to those if this is true. I do realize that it does make people upset but just remember that maybe your child that you are waiting for is not even born yet. All our times will come when the time is right. We have just finished and sent our paperwork to China and are waiting to get logged in or at least told we are. We have hope that our time will come and that we know that she will be there when it is.
The wait will totally be worth it……..
October 15th, 2007 at 3:03 am
Where is this supposed agency located? What state? Big or small agency? Last time this early referral thing happened, a lot of people thought it was the agency we are using. It wasn’t. BTW, our LID is 12/20/05.
October 15th, 2007 at 10:10 am
Is it possible that the CCAA is in cooperation with some smallish agencies for which there is a very real threat of shut-down due to the length of wait? I just crossed my mind that, perhaps, they might be sending them referrals for dates further out when they don’t have LIDs for current referrals so the agencies can collect the remainder of their fees from adoptive parents on a fairly steady basis so they can stay in business until the lull is straightened out.
I know it’s not standard practice for CCAA to be this cooperative or to care what happens to the agencies, especially if there are too many PAPs in the first place. However, if a particular agency really does have an exceptional relationship with someone(s) at the CCAA, they might be willing to help them out in this manner, right? Not to mention, China wouldn’t want there to be an uproar because their international adoptions fell through because of the length of wait causing an agency to close its doors. I would just think they would want to save face in this area as well. –Just a thought.
Wendy
October 15th, 2007 at 10:02 pm
RQ, is there anything new on this weird interlude? Is the rumor of the April 06 referrals officially dead, or is it still gasping for breath?
October 15th, 2007 at 10:13 pm
Definitely not dead, but still at the rumor stage.
Sorry, I wish I knew more.
October 16th, 2007 at 2:34 am
I wanted to comment on what Matzwd said. Our agency fits all the traits you listed- small, strong relationship with china, only works with China, etc and we are not moving any faster than anyone else.
October 16th, 2007 at 7:18 pm
CONGRATULATIONS to everyone receiving referrals!!! I don’t care how long or short your wait time was.
October 16th, 2007 at 7:25 pm
Wow, go away for a little “get away” and this is what happens! I am so happy for the families getting the referrals. I just received a letter from our agency saying they understand we are frustrated and “they are here for us”. I have not called them to see if “being there for us” means they will waive any fees :)
Oh well, I am happy for these families, whoever they are.
JEBMBC
October 19th, 2007 at 10:00 am
I have an early April 06 LID and don’t have a referral or know anyone in my DTC group that has received one. I’d undoubtedly take a kid if one was offered to me but unless you know families are paying $$$ more for quicker referrals, hate the agencies, not the families.