Comments on: China’s Stolen Children

By: babyincite

babyincite — Sun, 16 Mar 2008 18:50:54 +0000

There is so much misinformation being bandied about by some of you that you should take the same steps you expect from the reporter - fact check. For example, Chinese families with a biological child who financially qualify may adopt a child and more are doing just that. Thousands of dollars are not merely dropped into the hands of orphanage directors with no accounting. Undoubtedly there are some rogue officials - as there are in any country. But, those who perpetuate and defend false information on thise site do a disservice to adoptive parents and the children who’ve come home with them.

By: p12

p12 — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 19:42:34 +0000

French Marianne - What next, prove there is no Santa Clause?!
When someone makes an accusation, the burden of proof is on the one making it. So far all you substantiate your claims with are a rumor and a mysterious documentary which people are already starting to question…and who stole footage from a poster here on RQ.
I am not saying nothing irregular ever happened…but there just isn’t much to back up the “baby black market” IA connection.
I guess you just want to believe.

By: tellmemore

tellmemore — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 16:00:56 +0000

RQ wrote:

So, I will say again, that the black market trade in babies is not a part of the government run orphanage programs. It is not connected to the world of IA.

If you are basing this on the documentary, then this is true, but if you basing this on the findings from the Netherlands report, it is not true. The Netherlands report did find some sort of scandalous behavior that impicates SWIs.

How prevalent these behaviors are remains to be seen. If it is happening only rarely, it doesn’t have to be a big deal per se, but if it’s happening a lot, it SHOULD be a big deal.

By: French Marianne

French Marianne — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 15:24:45 +0000

p12

My assertions do not follow the facts…Could you tell me which facts you are thinking of?

Just to explain my view a little bit further:
RQ says “When Chinese people do adopt, they do it as a secret. And if you adopt through the government, it is not a secret. But if you adopt through the black market, it is.” It may”.
Well, may be this is true.

But I return the question to you : do we have clear evidences that Chinese people still behave this way? In fact there are also some rumors saying that Chinese people go to black market to get a child because SWI and CWI ‘prefer’ (inverted komas) to place children internationaly, as they get more money for them.

I will be truely happy to read some prooves of the contrary, since YES, I am not VERY SURE. But I do not understand the reasons why you seem to be so sure THAT IA IS NOT AT ALL INVOLVED IN BLACK MARKET neither.

Best regards

By: p12

p12 — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 14:04:41 +0000

French Marianne - You seem to be putting a lot of effort to make the IA community part of the problem (if one does exists). Your assertions do not follow the facts, and you definitely do not substantiate them yourself.
I personally would not place blame on PAP’s for “baby black markets” if I were not very sure of it…and frankly, it does not look like you are.

By: RumorQueen

RumorQueen — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 14:00:44 +0000

I stand by what I said - this show is not about international adoption. It is not about the government run orphanages in any way.

Part of the reason that people don’t adopt in China has to do with how important ancestors and bloodlines are. So, when people do adopt, they do it as a secret. And if you adopt through the government, it is not a secret. But if you adopt through the black market, it is.

So, I will say again, that the black market trade in babies is not a part of the government run orphanage programs. It is not connected to the world of IA.

By: French Marianne

French Marianne — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:49:41 +0000

You say “This show does not involve the IA community. It is about the black market within China”. What a simple and confortable way to look at things…
Of course this show does not mean necessarily that our children are stolen. BUT as part of the adoption program in China, the adoptive families can be seen as, in a way, responsible of black market. We are not entirely responsible of this, but again, as part of the system we have some responsability.

Regards
French Marianne

By: kms

kms — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 12:39:13 +0000

Am I missing something? I’m all for your going ahead with the adoption if the governments allow it, I encouorage it. But, does Euorpe do things differently than the US. With and LID of Jan 11 ‘06 how would you know your child is fostered vs orphanage?

By: Sagent

Sagent — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 12:39:07 +0000

“The black market is in existence because we have taken the Chinese personâ€™s ability away to adopt domestically”

I keep hearing a lot about filling our adoption “needs”
being a priority, possible cause for trafficking

um………………………international adoption is trickling

none of this makes sense to me.

By: p12

p12 — Thu, 13 Mar 2008 12:32:04 +0000

manon - You misunderstood me completely. My point was merely that I would think some/any English language news agency would pick up on a story this Big. The fact that they haven’t, has to make me wonder why. We have had “false alarms” in the past, and I am hoping this is the situation again. As for a TV show lying or stretching the truth for sensationalism, it wouldn’t be the 1st time in the Netherlands, or the USA. I find it crazy when I read posts by people saying it is “reasonable” now to halt IA this quickly on partial information.