Anger, Part Two
Today I’m going to talk mostly about what and who I am not angry with.
First on that list is the CCAA as a government agency. I believe that most of the employees of the CCAA have the best interest of the babies at heart. I’ve heard from too many people who have personally met them, I can’t believe any differently. By all accounts, the ‘worker bees’ at the CCAA take their jobs very seriously. I’ve heard mixed reviews about upper management, but I’m not directing my anger that way, either. I don’t know if upper management is making decisions or following orders, so I can’t really be angry at them, either. As I said yesterday, it is my hope that anyone responsible for creating this mess someday understand, in their heart, exactly what it is that they have done.
Next on the list of what I’m not angry at will have to be the one child policy. Surprised? Let’s look back in history for a bit to understand why the policy was put in place to begin with. After years of food shortages and people literally starving to death, the country was finally able to feed most everyone. But the government looked ahead and realized that if families continued having lots of kids that in another decade or two there would (again) not be enough food to feed everyone. Realize that in the late fifties and early sixties it is estimated that between 20 and 43 million people in China died of starvation. In some areas one out of every four people died of starvation. Imagine 16 of your friends and family, with four of them dead to starvation and you perhaps not far from it. Can you imagine how scary it would be to have the money to buy food but no food available to buy?
So, in the late 70’s when the one birth policy was put in place, it was done in part to keep the population from exploding back to what it had been when there wasn’t enough food to feed everyone. This is an over simplification of course since there was more at work during the famine than just population, but it’s a complicated subject and I’m trying to do this in a blog post and not a book. My point, kind of, is that it has been my experience that most Chinese people understand the reasons for the one child policy. I say this based on conversations I’ve had with them. They are sad that they are only allowed one child, but they understand the reasoning for the policy and they are not bitter about it. Many of them appreciate that it has kept the country from going back to the days of food shortages and say that it is necessary, even though they are sad that they can’t have more children. If most of them aren’t bitter about it, I can’t really be angry at it, either. I don’t like some of the results of the policy, and I hate the way it has been enforced in previous years, but I understand that it was a choice of children not being born at all, or children being born only to starve to death later.
Am I angry at TT’s orphanage? Not really. The emotional part of me wants to be angry with TT’s orphanage director for not running a better orphanage, and for not feeding the babies better. And for having all of those babies and toddlers there that were not made paper ready so they can have families. And most of all for making TT wait so long for a family. But the rational part of me knows that’s not realistic. I don’t know the reasons, and his hands may be tied. For all I know, someone at the CCAA told him he can send paperwork for ten babies a year and he’s doing the best he can within those limits. There were a lot of babies there, and I don’t know what kind of a budget he has to work with. Maybe it hurts him to see the babies on the verge of starvation, too. All I can do is hope that if he is choosing this path instead of being forced down it that he someday see what it is that he has done. Not with his eyes and mind, but with his heart.
Someone asked yesterday if I think the program was slowed deliberately. I know that not everyone agrees with me, but yes, I do believe it was slowed deliberately. Once upon a time I think that China was proud of running the best IA program on the planet. But somewhere I think that shifted, and someone decided that a world power shouldn’t be running the best IA program on the planet. World powers are supposed to take care of their own. And if you think about it, what better way to prove that there is no longer an abandonment problem? When the media asks about IA during the Olympics they are going to be told how there is no longer an abandonment problem and the proof will be the long wait to adopt a baby.
Some people visit their child’s orphanage and see an almost empty orphanage or an orphanage with only special needs babies. Others (like me) visit and see an orphanage full of babies who are not special needs, they (like me) are told the special needs children are in another part of the building. Now that I’ve got people asking, many are discovering that the empty orphanages still have almost as many babies in their care as they did two or three or four years ago on their first trip, but that those babies are now in foster care. Same number of babies, they just aren’t visible anymore. This isn’t true everywhere, in the economically booming areas the orphanages aren’t seeing as many abandonments, but in economically depressed areas, and areas with factories that hire mostly young women, some orphanages have more babies than ever. Remember, the one child policy is not the only reason mothers decide they can’t raise a child. It happens all over the world, even where there is no such policy. When someone can’t afford to raise a child they look for someone who can.
There are some who think the wait will speed up some after the Olympics. Some agencies are saying the ‘donation’ being raised will be the reason for the speed up, that the CCAA will say that the higher donation gave enough incentive to the orphanage directors so they would spend the money to make the babies paper ready. But other agencies are saying there will be no speed up, that things are going to be the same and possibly get even slower. I don’t really know who to believe at this point, but without a backlog of finding ads I’m not sure how things will immediately speed up. I am told that most of the babies in orphanages now did not have a finding ad placed when they arrived, and that means they likely will never be able to be adopted through IA. Finding ads are, for the most part, only placed for babies the orphanage intends to make paper ready for IA. If they don’t intend to make them available for IA there is no finding ad placed.
To try to wrap this up, as I said yesterday, I don’t really have anyone or anything to direct my anger towards. The best I can do is just hope that whoever made the decisions that created this situation will someday completely understand what it is that they have done.
As for what I’m angry about, I think many of you misinterpreted that. I’m angry because TwinkleToes laid in a crib with no one to hold her, and barely enough food to survive, while our family waited to be allowed to adopt her. We were all forced to wait. It wasn’t just RK and GG and I waiting. TT was waiting, too.
I’m angry because my child starved both physically and emotionally for more than a year longer than she should have had to. The mama bear in me rears up at that every once in a while and there is no way to deny how it makes me feel. If she’d been adopted at a year or slightly less instead of the age she was adopted then I believe her life would be much different than it is going to be. She’s a survivor, she’ll survive it. But the point is that she shouldn’t have to. Her brain was starved of nourishment and stimulation at a very crucial part of her life. The brain works on a timetable, and she missed out on learning things when she was supposed to be learning them. I’ve had to come to terms with the fact that this can be worked around, but it can’t be fixed.
I’ve directed my anger in the healthiest way I believe that I can. It’s not going away, but I believe I’ve made peace with it. Mostly.
And I’m talking about it because I see that I’m not the only one dealing with these feelings.
July 22nd, 2008 at 9:58 am
Thank you RQ for sharing. Your post today is very personal to me and you worded it so well. I am a bit angry as I wonder about so many questions: why is my daughter still waiting at almost 3 years old? Why won’t they send the paperwork we need to move forward (LOA)? Day 71, but who is counting?! Why did her orphanage wait so long to submit her paperwork? She was 23 months old! Did they think she was not “eligible” for IA? (Please don’t flame me as I know she is eligible but I have heard that often children’s paperwork is submitted after visiting families encourage orphanage personnel that their is a family out there that would love to adopt that child. We know visiting families advocated for our little girl a year ago. Why is she so tiny? Is she not receiving enough food or has she somehow given up subconsciously? Why is she going to have to work so extra hard to overcome her unrepaired cleft needs and other needs when she could have come home years earlier? Did they not think she would live or did they not care? I will probably never know the answers but it is hard not to take it personal. I too have those Mama Bear feelings and we don’t even know all the difficulties we have yet to face with our little girl who has been in an orphanage for 33 months and is still waiting because we are waiting on paperwork from China!!!
Hoping
July 22nd, 2008 at 10:18 am
Let’s all take a look and find the anger in the fact that there are kids in our own country languishing in orphanages for years. They’re not cute babies anymore, they might have sibling or two that they simply can’t let go of, they might have had so much abuse it blocks their coping skills and makes them at first appear unlovable. Let’ take a look at these kids and reach out to them! Let’s get angry at the fact that there are parents in our 1st world nation that allow their children to be abused, malnourished, mistreated. And people are paying agencies to adopt from China an arm and a leg (with no referall dates in sight) while these kids come with state subsidies and paid in-state college education, anything to encourage people to be loving and accept them into a home. Let’s not forget that we DON’T have a one child policy and STILL we have these issues. Who are we to judge China!
Take a look at some waiting American kids at:
http://www.adoptuskids.org/states/aici/browse.aspx
You can check out
July 22nd, 2008 at 10:32 am
RQ..I don’t have your connections, but I too feel there is a deliberate slow down. I guess I am suspicious, but I too get the since that China is phasing out their IA and this wait is a way to ‘thin the herd’ of parents.
China is 30 million women short. I watched a documentary on women being kidnapped and taken to villages as men are finding there are no women available. Lisa Ling did this documentary and I found it interesting and disturbing. You have a country where the majority of men will not have a mate and the consequences are occuring.
I too am not upset with the one child law. It went into place in an attempt to save a society. The government was warned of the possible consequences of this policy by their own scholars.
The children are the losers in this situation. Our governement does not do a good job with the children in foster care. I see the negative effects all the time on these children. I think individuals do care but the system is not set to care. Government beauracrcy and their ineptness is at every level both in China and here. The children will always lose.
July 22nd, 2008 at 10:36 am
lulubell, did you bother to read what I wrote, or are you just reacting based on what you think it probably says?
My anger is personal.
And where on earth did you get the idea I’m angry with China? I said yesterday I was not. And I think it was more than obvious today that I’m not angry with China as a country. How ridiculous would that be to hold the entire country responsible?
Yeah, the US system is screwed. No argument there. But that has nothing to do with my personal anger about my child.
July 22nd, 2008 at 10:37 am
First:
RQ~thanks for laying it out there. This is a sad, sad situation. I’m glad you’re coming to terms with your anger. Hopefully in the future, TT can come to terms with any she may have also.
Second:
Lulabell~ although I think your post has merit as a discussion tool (and I have no doubt there will be a lot of discussion about it) I think it was really insensitive to post this in response to RQs very personal post about her family.
Somehow, I think its going to be an interesting RQ day.
susan
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:12 am
Lulabell, I don’t understand your response at all. You should not be judgmental of others expressing their feelings. Each situation is unique. For what it is worth and not that it is any of your business, we looked into foster care and hit a brick wall. I know of a family here in our town very personally and they have been waiting a LONG time for a placement and are open to up to 4 siblings! The US system does not make it EASY for families to adopt foster children.
In the end, we knew our daughter would come from China. We just were LID in late 2007 so we have not been waiting for a long time. We knew our daughter would be a waiting child with needs. She has two very serious needs. I am not saying that to say kuddos to me, but just to point out that people are called to wherever they are for specific reasons.
I am not at all angry at China. Just yesterday I found myself in a situation where I was defending her people to the Vietnamese ladies who were doing my pedicure. They had much contempt for China and its one-child policy and I found myself “getting my back up” as I tried to explain that their views were not based in reality. They were also very critical of our daughter’s birthmother for abandoning her. Again, I explained to them that I did not agree with them for some very specific reasons. I also told them I would be forever grateful to her and to China for our daughter. If not for the love of many people on the front lines, I don’t believe our daughter would still be alive today.
What I don’t understand is why they waited so long to submit her paperwork. There is probably more to the story that would make it clearer but that I’ll never know.
Again, I think your post was very insensitive but that is just my two cents worth.
Hoping
http://www.youbelong.net/theirwins
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:20 am
I’m not so sure we should discuss lulubell’s entry. Is she a newbie? She doesn’t sound like someone who is adopting from China, I think she may have stumbled upon this and is trying to flame us. That is just how I’m reading it. She made exactly the same kind of comment that I have gotten twice in the past, once from a coworker before we brought our dd home, and once from a stranger in a store. Her comments are fairly irrelevant to IA, so I don’t really find it worthy of discussing in this particular forum.
dilinn
dd from yujiang swi in Jiangxi
forever ours 9/3/07
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:33 am
I don’t know that I can say I’ve ever been angry since we started this process 3 years ago. Frustrated, sad, heartbroken, but I don’t know whether anger is the right word. Our situation is very different than a lot of other families because we never tried to be pregnant on our own; I was adopted as a toddler after being neglected and abused by my birth parents. I guess I reserve my anger for those that allow such abuses to take place. I was lucky that the authorities did intervene.
As we considered our options for having a family China’s IA program spoke to our hearts and souls. We understand the rationale for the 1 child policy and the preference for sons over daughters. Not that we agree, but it’s not for us to judge centuries of a culture that we cannot possibly understand. We try to believe that the vast majority of those associated with the IA program, from CCAA officials to caregivers in remote orphanages, do the very best that they can for the children.
My biggest frustration is that we can’t seem to get a straight answer from the authorities. I’d love to see an admission that the Olympics has impacted IA (it’s affected everything else!) and to let agencies know the longer term intentions, the real numbers, etc. A lot of my emotions would stabilize if I only knew the answer to “when” is our daughter coming home.
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:44 am
Lulubell ~ Based on your message, I got the impression that you are just visiting this blog for the latest information on adoption from China and looking for a place to vent about IA as you are adopting domestically from the States. Am I correct?
Cheers to all!
LID 2/9/06 (Soon!)
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:48 am
We haven’t even fully started the process (I just turned 29) but already I feel like it’ll never happen. Reading the post and comments from yesterday, and now today…. its crushing. I do’nt know what to think, or to do. Do we continue? Do we put in our application in 4 months, then work on our dossier? I’d hate to invest so much time, money, and heart into this to never see it happen, to have it taken away.
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:50 am
Lulabell~ this is a place for folks adopting from China and so your post is quite insenitive and makes a blanket judgement. I find it offensive that because I am infertile that I should accept any child and be grateful for it. I chose China because I work in Child Psychiatry with alot of domestic adoptive children. You are right in the bigger picture that our society has not done ‘right’ by those children. I chose China because you do not see these children in the mental health arena as you do from other countries. When people ask why I did not adopt domestically I state because the USA does not do ‘right’ by their children. Too many are fetal alcohol, drug babies, and have endured so much abuse that they have reactive attachment disorders and such severe PTSD that many become psychotic.
Many of these parents adopted these children and were not told some hard truths and so many wish they never adopted as it has ruined families. Now this story is not true for all folks who adopt domestically, but don’t you dare think that most of us have gone down this road lightly. We all have reasons for where we adopt and why and I for one chose China because for one reason they are so poor they do not have access to the drugs and alcohol that have damaged many a brain in our country.
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:51 am
Thank You RQ…I feel the same.
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:59 am
WOW! What timing of this subject. This past week my angry has grown to where I think my head will explode and I just want to scream at anyone! Then to look on here and see the subject being discussed, it has brought me SOME relief to know I’m not alone in this. Lately I’ve become numb about the adoption. I’ve stopped reading about attachment issues, I’ve stopped learning the language, I’ve stopped scrap booking, I’ve stopped attending our local support group activities. I’ve just be distancing myself from it because it just doesn’t seem real anymore. We decorated the babies room way too soon and I’m regretting it. We can’t even open the door anymore. We are back and forth about even continuing this ride on the roller coaster when there’s no end in sight. We would have never even started this process if we had known about this agonizing wait. We could have put that money towards further fertility testing, or even towards embryo adoption. We aren’t even going to attend our yearly family reunion this year because I can’t deal with the questions that will be asked since we all thought that there would be another addition to the family this year.
Friends who have adopted have been a wonderful support system for us and they often say that our baby WILL be here before we know it. But will she? China won’t guarantee and neither can our agency. But we knew that going in but we also didn’t think we’d be waiting for 2+ years!
My anger, right now, is directed towards the Chinese government who wants to control everything, regardless of who it hurts (which is mostly the children). They are putting their IMAGE and MONEY before the lives of these innocent, sweet children. If the government cared so much for their people as they say they do, then they shouldn’t care what it looks like that they have children who are abandoned and need a family. EVERY single country in this world has this problem of abandoned children, they aren’t alone. The children in EVERY country should come first, not dollar signs. And IF (and that’s a huge IF) this process speeds up because of the increase of fees, then to me this confirms that money was the problem all along. I personally feel that China should stop accepting any more dossiers until they can dust off the ones they have and take care of them. I feel that we deserve some HONEST answers here. We are all here for the children and they should be also. I get the impression that they “hiding” some of these children in foster homes so the media doesn’t see them in the orphanages. Out of sight is NOT out of mind. From what I’ve heard from families who have traveled within the last 6 months (for adoption and business), the babies are there. And they are getting older as we are and are becoming less adoptable the older they get. It’s just not right!
We all had to go through every hoop imaginable just to prove that we would be fit parents and then we still have to sit here (for over 2 years now) and have no idea when (or if) our baby will come home. China has put age limits for us parents but they don’t make it any easier when we sit here getting older and older while we wait. Now we have the stress of our own age issues to add to this, who would have thought. I would not be surprised if we were soon notified by our agency that China has closed their IA program. (God I hope I’m wrong too). I can’t imagine that day but I wouldn’t be surprised.
Someone the other day asked me if I would do this again if I had the opportunity to and, with tears in my eyes, I said no I would not. And my advice to others who are looking into IA through China is to ask themselves if they are able to wait YEARS to build their family. When (or if) I get to hold by baby, I’m sure this wait will seem like nothing and I won’t have any regrets, but until then I have these feelings and have to work through them. Right now they are my honest, true feelings.
I know I’ve rambled on here but we all need to do that every so often and RQ has given us the place to do it. Thanks RQ for giving us a place to go for the most honest information as possible and for a place to vent without being judged.
July 22nd, 2008 at 12:06 pm
Lulubell, your post isn’t appropriate here. You make some good points, but that’s a different situation than the one RQ opened up for discussion.
Personally, we would have liked to adopt domestically as well. But we live in a state with a judicial history of favoring birth families who change their mind even after adoptions are supposedly finalized (even when there were drugs or abuse involved), and we weren’t going to go through that. Yes, that makes me angry as well. In our own country as well as in many other countries, the welfare of children is simply not the priority it should be, and as someone who cares about children, that makes me mad.
But RQ brought up a very specific point and you’ve introduced a red herring into the conversation that frankly was kind of insulting to those of us who are choosing to adopt for China. It seems to me you also totally mis-read RQ’s post.
July 22nd, 2008 at 12:14 pm
RQ, I understood your post yesterday. And today’s post is even more to the point. My heart aches reading it. I struggle with the same anger issues for the same reasons and I think it’ll get harder when DD is older and understands better.
Thanks for bringing this tough discussion to the blog. I hope people will listen to what you are saying rather than just skimming the subject and then replying. There’s a lot to learn and discuss in your post.
July 22nd, 2008 at 12:17 pm
I just wanted to point out a few things based on Lulabell’s post. First of all, I agree with Ladeeesquire - it was an insensitive comment. Lulabell, I have to wonder if you feel so strongly about it why you are even on a China adoption site.
Second, we have gone through the U.S. system - for three years. And we still are childless. So, yes, I am angry at the U.S. system.
We fell in love with the China program (maybe this time we’ll have a child.) but lo and behold, it’s messed up, too.
So, yeah, I can see where RQ’s anger stems from. I only hope my child doesn’t have the same issues. But based on his orphanage’s history and his age, I know we may be faced with some of this, as well.
It also really angers me when people defend China by dragging the U.S. through the dirt. We all have problems, worldwide, let’s not make a contest out of it.
Violet
July 22nd, 2008 at 12:33 pm
Maybe if the US didn’t make it so hard to adopt more people would adopt US kids. I agree that there are many kids here in the US that need loving families. A lot of them who are readily available have disabilities and emotional/behavioral issues that a lot of families are not prepared to care for.
I personally have been through one failed US adoption and have a friend who has now been through TWO failed US adoptions. My heart still grieves for the little boy we called our own for 7 days in our home before I had to give him back to his birthmother. I can’t let my heart be broken like that again. It is just too painful. That is why our family chose China. I believe this is the route that was chosen for us and we will wait for our daughter to be placed in our arms at the right moment. But I can’t have another one ripped out of my arms again.
Lulubell, while I believe your post was well-meaning I did feel the way it was worded in response to such an emotional and personal post by RQ and many others, it did come across as being insensitive. I believe that many people have found their child through the US adoption system. However, for whatever reason, there are those of us who have not.
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:01 pm
I do not get to post often now because of the new child and the one getting used to being a big sister. I have to say RQ that your posts make so much sense to me. The “anger” I have in my heart is not simple and not directed toward any specific entity. It is probably more what folks call “regret.”
When I saw my new daughter (2.5 yo) eat paper from a shopping bag in my house because she thought I would not feed her in time, my heart broke. I know they did the best they could in her SWI. We went there and we saw what they do and how they have to deal with overwhelming issues with few resources.
The regret in my heart has more to do with lost opportunity for her full potential than it does with anything I can point to. I wish it were that easy to say such-and-such is to blame. It’s just not that simple.
On the other hand, what would have happened if she did not get the opportunity to be in a family? The mind can grow weary of thoughts like this. So, at least for now, I will focus on her language development and hope she can move from saying “dowda” to “powder.” And from “Maneh” to “Mommy.” We shall see what happens in the future. For now, I try hard to focus on her wonderful little “being” and hold her while she rages. I think everyone is in a different place with this topic depending on where they are in the process but for me I am trying to reach some sort of “process closure.” Perhaps RQ is telling me that is easier said than done.
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:04 pm
We live in Canada and we had our homestudy done by the wife of the man who ran our local Childrens Aids services here in our counties and this is what she did to us.
She had us wait from Jan to August before our HS was complete. She did not like our references and made us find others. She interigated our children to the full. She made my husband and I feel that we were not suitable to be the parents of a new child. She wanted us to become foster parents for 5 years and then consider adoption.
And the biggest is that she had brought to us 3 files on children with severe medical conditions (because of my work background). We told us that we had no choice but to adopt one of these children before she would even consider us to be eligiable to adopt internationally.
Don’t get us wrong, we would of adopted any child but we already have two sons and were afraid that we would have to push them in the back and have to spend 100% of over attention to a child of special needs.
I work with children in a school here in our community and do so badly want to take some of them home but our children would suffer too.
I am so much in love with a boy at work who has downsyndrome, that I do everyday talk about him at home and that I do want to take him but he is alot of one on one support and he can not let him out of your site due to harming himself or others.
We are in this adoption for the long haul and know that someday we will be able to travel to China and bring home a baby.
We would adopt domestic if the system here would allow you to keep the aby, toddler and not return them to the home where to abuse started. I am all about second chances but sometimes have my concerns…
Littleperson647
LID 11-23-07
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:13 pm
“lost opportunity for her full potential”
Thanks portlandval - that’s a big part of it. I hadn’t really been able to name it, but now that you have, I know you’re right.
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:21 pm
I am just waiting for lullubell to respond!
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:22 pm
also, thank you RQ. without this forum it would be a much harder wait.
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:42 pm
I feel for everyone, especially those who had fertility issues and this is supposed to be their first child. That is our situation. We are attending one more agency held support group in Aug. The only reason is because hopefully they will have some answers about them not getting accreditation with the new Hague. It is two weeks later and still no answers. Luckily, we are still with the old Hague(paperwork). We also considered domestic but I knew I would breakdown if the birthmother changed her mind. My parent’s friends had this happen to them twice and they lost all the money they paid to the birthmother(her expenses,ect). So many other children face so many behavioral challenges from being in the “system” so long. Why is it so hard to adopt?? So many loving parents and all this red tape to go through. Why does it have to cost so much money?? It should not if the real issue was finding loving homes for children. People ask me about China all the time. I am numb to it now. I feel like not even caring anymore. We have waiting for 8 yrs. for a child. I just say things are not going well and I prefer not to discuss it. If things look better in the future, I will let you know. This usually stops the questions. I was invited to another baby shower and I wish they would not ask me anymore. I have not attended any for years. I also avoid family things and Christmas parties because there is always a new baby there.
July 22nd, 2008 at 1:46 pm
RQ, I wonder if your daughter’s orphanage was unusual in having so many nsn babies? We’ve adopted twice from China and from both provinces I hear that nsn abandonments are way, way down and healthy babies in orphanage or foster care are now rare. On our most recent adoption trip our guide told us that local families had wanted to adopt some of the babies in our group but had been told they could not, because they were already in the IA program.
I totally sympathize with the anger felt by all those waiting and by anyone who has adopted a child who had to wait so much longer than seems right. But would you agree, RQ, that people waiting should try to stop hoping for a speed up? I’ve been hearing of people really pinning their hopes on a speed up after the Olympics. Could happen, I guess, but it seems unlikely to me.
July 22nd, 2008 at 2:18 pm
frannysmom: the director of our dd’s orphanage said the same thing when a member of our group asked about the increase in wait times. “abandonments are down, domestic adoptions are increasing, economic status is better here now, so fewer babies being abandoned”. Our guide, who was wonderful, didn’t really understand why we would question that…it seemed truthful to her based on what she’d seen and been told. She was a wonderful guide and in some ways seemed “westernized” due to her youth and job, but she definitely didn’t question the word of the officials. Sounded pretty much like a recitation of the party line, if you ask me…exactly what they want people to see and believe. There were definitely empty beds in the orphanage when we visited, but the foster families we went to (without authorization) had 5-6 babies each!
I agree 100% with RQ, and have told many close families and friends: I believe the slowdown was completely deliberate in order to put forward a good image when the media is in China for the Olympics. The wait time will show that there are way fewer abandonments in China and there is no longer a preference for girls to the extent that it used to be. I for one am not buying it, and I am anxious to find out if the subject does come up during all the media “side trips” during the olympics.
I think there will be a speed up after the Olympics, but not right away. It will be gradual and will probably never go back to the days of one month referred every month.
July 22nd, 2008 at 2:24 pm
All I know is we’ve been waiting almost 28 freaking months…………yes, I have quite a bit of anger to vent…..I guess I need to just keep my thoughts to myself….wouldn’t want to offend anyone. And as I’ve noticed on some boards….no matter what you post as your personal feelings, someone out there always manages to be offended. That’s why my anger is only vented with my true friends who know my pain and KNOW how much I long to be a mom.
Susan
July 22nd, 2008 at 3:50 pm
We were DTC 7-26-06 and are in the process of switching to Russia (pursuing a child of Asian ethnicity). At the current rate of referrals, we would be waiting 3 more years if there is not a “speed-up”. I am also angry that we are not receiving straight answers from China in order to make an informed decision for our family. Remember “after the new year, we will go to 15 day batches”. Both us and our DD are getting older and older as this wait goes by. We are so sad that both our daughters will not be from China, but we of course will love DD#2 and her Russian heritage. BTW, our agency expects us to receive a referral in 4 weeks to 4 months for anyone who might be considering switching to another country.
July 22nd, 2008 at 3:52 pm
Wait4ever
Your post brings tears to my eyes.
We are waiting as well. Our agency did not get their Hague accred. I emailed the Hague itself and they replied that we should all be alright.
I know about the baby shower thing and all that.
I moved here 6 years ago and we could not adopt from certain countries because of not having citizenship. I just got my citizenship and am now too old for other countries!
Where I come from we don’t have baby showers, so that was all new to me!
I have read some good books like Louise Hay books and other “oprah type” books to feel peaceful about it all. Yes I feel bad somedays and literally in shock that this is my life. But I am much better now that I have made more of an effort to be myself. I try and be the person I was before all of this. Because you are on the road to adoption you must be already a strong person. Your baby will be here. You will want everyone to be happy for you. I find now that I don’t go to everything all of the time. When I am in the mood I go with a good heart and am often surprised that I do enjoy myself. and find that I am really happy for other people. Not everyones path to having a baby is easy. Its just that they don’t tell you. I really try and focus on the positive. I get my “baby kick” by minding my niece who is beautiful. I hope this helps
July 22nd, 2008 at 3:55 pm
First of all - RQ, perhaps you SHOULD write a book. In all honesty, I don’t know that I’ve met anyone who has been more knowledgable or better able to explain the situation in China, its history, and what brought us to where we are now. Your honesty and openness in sharing information about your daughters is very helpful to all of us and much appreciated. While we may not always agree on everything, you have definitely earned my respect.
Second, to Lulubell - One, when I started paperwork for my first adoption from China, I called the Dept.of Social Services and inquired about domestic adoption. The social worker there advised me to go to China. If I wanted to be a foster parent, she could help me. If I wanted a child to adopt, she made it very clear that the department’s main objective would always be to create a healthy situation for the children to be reunited with their birth parents. This was the DEPARTMENT’S main object; but not hers. She was actually quite sad, bitter and pretty much ready to find a new job. Some parents can handle the risk and heartache of foster-to-adopt situations; but some of us cannot.
Two, Lulubell, I went to the federal and state websites to search US children legally available for adoption. My criteria was “female minor special needs age 5 and under” as I have a 6-year-old and have been advised to maintain birth order. The search came up “0 matches found”. So I extended my search to older children. Many came up, and I reviewed them. Each child had a note “cannot be placed with a younger child in the home”. My choices were young children with profound special needs (which I am completely unequiped to willingly take on) or children who couldn’t be placed with my first daughter in the home.
Three, Lulubell, my agency has a domestic adoption program that I was considering. A very important clause, however, changed my mind. The clause stated “Parents chosing the domestic adoption program must be open to a child born to parents with substance abuse and mental health issues.” I’ve watched children grow up with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, bi-polar disorder, etc., and it’s not as easy as you may think. It takes an amazing person who can knowingly and willingly walk into that situtation and take on all that follows.
And lastly, Lulubell, some of us don’t show well on a website presented to birth mothers looking to choose adoptive parents for their baby. Most birth mothers want married couples in their 30’s with a big house and money in the bank. That leaves many of us out.
So please don’t try to make us feel disloyal to the children in the US. Our system makes it very difficult for its children to be adopted.
July 22nd, 2008 at 4:27 pm
RQ– As someone just finishing up their dossier and heading into this long wait, I would enjoy hearing what you think the outlook is for me. My agency is saying that the wait is going to continue to build to at least a 3.5 to 4 years until it begins to come back down. I’m not sure what the answers are on the wait. I guess you can only know what the answers are for YOURSELF and Your situation, as everyone is different. For me and my husband, the wait will be extremely difficult. Still I feel drawn to adopt from China. So many emotions run high when we think about our children and our families. It’s hard not to be angry.
Again RQ — any comments for someone just going into this??
July 22nd, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Thank you Shamrock for the kind words. It is nice to know others feel the same as I do. My mood was on an upswing when I found out we made it out of review and then on June 30th, my world came crashing down again when I learned about our agency not getting Hague acc. The letter made it seem like we could lose our place in line possibly and have to start all over. Someone “high up” in the agency went to China to talk to CCAA to get accurate answers. We still don’t know what they found out. I guess I am tired of this roller coaster. Not just China, but all the infertility “stuff”. Unless you have had to go for blood tests every day, inject yourself with drugs, and wait on pins and needles for the phone calls from the clinic to find out if this month was the one, noone can understand. Then you make peace with it and decide that God has other plans for you. Then get so excited about the wonderful world of adoption, and this happens. I am trying to just enjoy life one day at a time. Somedays it is easier than others. I am grateful to be able to talk here. My mom asked me to consider Russia while we wait. I said she when she gives me an extra $25,000. That was the end of that conversation.
July 22nd, 2008 at 4:35 pm
“First of all - RQ, perhaps you SHOULD write a book.” YES! I agree completely and would buy it.
As for choosing a country to adopt from, I don’t even think a person needs to have attempted a U.S. or other home country adoption program before choosing China. EVERY country has difficult adoption processes. EVERY country has children in need of homes. NOT EVERY country is a match for every adoptive parent. It shouldn’t matter one bit which country a person adopts from. Children are children EVERYWHERE.
July 22nd, 2008 at 4:53 pm
About it maybe just being an official line about nsn abandonments being down, I can offer that in my daughters’ two provinces, in one case it was the guide’s assessment and in another the info is based on personal reports from adoptive parents who have recently visited our daughter’s swi and talked to the director, toured the facilities. The year our dd entered that swi (2003), there were healthy baby girls being abandoned in that city every few days. I’ve been told that such abandonments are now rare–and that domestic adoptions are way up. I am by no contesting the fact that RQ’s dd was in an orphanage filled with babies. I just think there is a lot of evidence out there suggesting that perhaps that situation is unusual now. At the very least, I think it’s clear that no one should base their hopes on a post-Olympic speed up on reports that some orphanages still have a lot of nsn babies.
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:02 pm
Findinghope, I couldn’t have said it better myself. Thank you for expressing the problems with our crappy system here is the USA.
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:06 pm
Findinghope…Amen sister you said it better than I could. I work with a social worker who is African American. She is a therapist for children. She used to work for an adoption agency in her early years of her career. She wanted to adopt an African American baby. She chose a baby because she is aware of the system. It took her 9 years! She went 3 times to pick up her baby only to be told at the last minute the mom decided to keep her. It was agonizing to see her go through this. She did finally bring home a baby girl and was there for the birth. The parents were so poor and already had 3 children and could not afford to feed a fourth.
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:28 pm
Frannysmom, your last post sort of shows exactly what I was trying to say. All the directors are saying exactly the same thing…abandonments are down, domestic adoptions are up. Seems like they are all reading the same memo if you ask me. Our guide was from Hunan and traveled to all different provinces and had been told the same thing every where she went; the director of dd’s orphanage was in Jiangxi with exactly the same answer. And now you are repeating almost the identical quote from your guide, the director, and parents who had visited. Had we not visited the foster homes we might have believed him too, although I was already skeptical. Doesn’t seem like you could change centuries of cultural preferences and ideologies over the course of one year. My point is that the director and many of the guides are saying the exact same thing almost everywhere. Could that make it true? I suppose..it just sounds too canned to me.
Someone also asked the director how many babies were abandoned on average and brought to the orphanage. He said only a few a month these days, on average. Good answer, backs up the “fewer abandoned babies” concept. However, the newspaper with dd’s finding add shows WAY more than that for her SWI, and WAY more than that for the other SWI’s in the paper. Considering that in our travel group of eight families, most babies with birthdays within days of each other, that definitely was an understatement on the director’s part, but it was the RIGHT thing for him to say.
I certainly respect your opinion that nsn abandonments are down, I know that many agree with you. What I saw with my eyes just didn’t jive with what I heard the director saying.
And that is my 2 cents, FWIW.
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:30 pm
I’m angry and I’m not even in line anymore. We have our precious baby. She was abandoned at age 10 months in Yunnan Province because, in most probability, poverty amoung the minority groups there. Maybe because she was a 2nd girl - maybe because of a million other reasons. The orphanage sent up her paperwork really quickly, for which I am most grateful. From the outside looking in, it seems they took very good care of her and she was in some sort of foster care. I am not angry about the treatment because I feel they do the best that they know how and that their customs are different than ours. For example, I really believe she was tied or strapped for long periods or either papoosed. She was not able to roll over or crawl and she was around 17 months old when we got her. But, she was healthy and happy. She was around music and could clap her hands. She was kept on a bottle so I had the priviledge of that bottle bonding time.
I am most angry at the system that has caught these thousands of eager parents. In late 2004 when we began sensing the “call” to adopt we were aware of a China that had many orphans in need of adopting. Every research we did at that time pointed that to us. The agencies were traveling groups regularly. Then, like clock-work, a deliberate slow-down occured putting each log-in group a month latter: first it was 7 months wait, then 8, then 9….every month another month was added. Then certain “researchers” began to give waiting parents a guilt trip about our motivations for adopting. Yes I have biological children of my own……maybe I should step aside and let others ahead and forget it. Well I am sure the complexities of this China IA program are way beyond what I can comprehend because I don’t have all the facts. I don’t believe anyone entity does. Agencies have their own little niches to promote. I really feel for the agencies that are doing their best to place children. I am angry that these estimated 30,000 parents are waiting and that they are being pushed and pressured to back out. The children suffer. I’m sorry for the ramble. But I do believe with all my heart that RQ would be able to write a beautiful book with so much logic and research in it that it would blow us away. I can’t imagine the information she has gleened that she can’t even share. She’s earned her PhD in Chinaadopttalk for certain.
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:33 pm
Although you make a good case for the one child policy, RQ, I have to say one thing. The basic assumption you are making is EITHER/OR. Either there are less people, or they starve. If you step back, and look at the whole picture, you may find other options. Like a political system that looks to increase the economic strengths and opportunities for growth in the country, even at the price of granting its citizens openness and democracy. You are assuming that the government and its paradigms are unchangeable, and the ones that have to give are the people and their reproductive freedom.
We are very much in love here, in the US, with our personal freedoms. I think it’s not inappropriate to wish the same for the Chinese. Now that I am forever tied to China, i am surprised that someone could find that kind of complete lack of reproductive freedom acceptable for the Chinese, when we would revolt ourselves, and rightly.
Thanks for a great place to discuss these important topics!
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:33 pm
You can tell in heart beat those who don’t like the idea of folks adopting out of country. Then there are those who don’t like the idea of adopting out of race. Of course, 99% of the time these are the same people who HAVE NOT adopted nor do they have any plans to adopt.
They just want to tell everybody what is right and wrong void of any actual commitment on their part. How convenient… Talk about anger. I don’t cut those people any slack…
If you’re not in the hot kitchen cooking then shut up, sit down and color…
peace (I know-but this junk fires me up)
fm
LID 1/27/06
http://www.alyzabethan.blogspot.com
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:46 pm
I was also angry that one of my daughters had to wait to be adopted. While in a loving foster family, the loss of that family caused her great trauma that continues to this day. She still fears that she’ll lose us if she isn’t good, and she has (rare) crying fits that break your heart. If she had been adopted sooner, she would have adjusted much better. I understand the director of her SWI wanted to wait to make sure the babies were healthy before referral to please APs. Couldn’t have backfired more.
As for the dearth of healthy babies available for adoption, I have no doubt the number of available babies is down for various reasons, but I cannot believe the “supply” (to use a crude term) dropped so much so quickly. A concerted decision was in play. I don’t know, though, that things will turn around after the Olympics even with babies available for adoption. China could hide the problem indefinitely if it had reason to (such as promoting SN adoption).
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:58 pm
I applaud FindingHope and RQ for saying things well.
Also, I will add my frustration: that of having to likely having to re-register in another 18 months. I agree completely that PAPs need to undergo thorough scrutiny for the sake of their future child, but after a certain point, it is only ridiculous. (In the US, our fingerprints expire after 18 months, so we have to physically get re-fingerprinted in addition to paying for this extension. (No flames please, I know for most, a 1-time free renewal has been introduced.) )
Dear wife and I are also now in our 40s, were LID 2/11/07, and need to determine what steps - if any- to take to adopt again. With one child now, the emotional risk of having a domestic birth-mom change mind immediately afterward (again, that IS her right, I do not complain about that) affects not only wife and I, but also our 4 year old.
I’ve started looking at domestic agencies: several (but, not all) state that folks over 40 don’t fit into their PAP pool logistics.
Also, if you incur expenses on a domestic adoption that does not occur, you can still claim that as part of the Fed adoption tax credit…. if your int’l adoption does not occur - and I believe especially if we bow out due to the long expected wait- we are not able to claim any tax credit. (Again, please no flames.. we have worked hard to set this money for China adoption aside, and we have finances to do ONE more adoption, so seriously starting domestic makes our completion of our China adoption much more unlikely. )
I believe the greatest impact toward the referral levels never getting back to what they once were, is a result of the increase in China domestic adoptions and there being fewer kids available for IA.
I also believe that the extreme slowdown we are experiencing is a result of Govt/bureaucratic factors. I hope that we soon see the day were we get 15ish day referrals… for a country of China’s size, I have to believe that an additional 100 referrals per month, including kids up to 2 or 2.5 years, could quickly occur.
I also get angry when others (some of whom have posted here) accuse us of NOT pursuing some other avenue, and assuming certain mindsets about us. Someone said ‘All politics is local,” well, I believe “All adoption decisions are local (family-based).’ People choose their path to expanding their family in the way they feel is best for them. Other paths may have been acceptable, but since you generally do one at a time, you chose the path you feel is BEST, at that time. Once in motion, that path cannot easily be veered from.
Ugh, I may have exceeded some limit on message length.
RQ, this was my first post… and I appreciate all of your efforts, information, and approach.
Regards,
JuneBugsDad
July 22nd, 2008 at 7:34 pm
Thank you, RQ, for your heartfelt posts. I, too, have been feeling very angry lately. I know that for me, at least, a lot of it has to do with the fact that it seems that everyone I know is pregnant or has just had a baby. It’s hard to look at friends who got married after we were DTC and now have their little babies to ooh and ahh over. I know that many choose adoption over biological children, but adoption sort of chose us, and it’s hard to wait while others skip in front of us in the “mommy line.” A lot of my anger today is towards the process itself. I wish it were more transparent, and I get frustrated with the lack of information.
A somewhat related question for you or anyone else who may know. If part of the problem (as it seems to be) is that there are babies who are not being made “paper-ready,” is there a way for us (as waiting or adoptive parents) to help? I mean, I already financially support Half the Sky & LWB, but is there an organization that helps SWIs with the paperwork? Could there be? I would gladly volunteer a week of my life to go to China and help with paperwork (or, better yet, play with the babies so that others would be free to do the paperwork). I am fairly certain I’m not alone. Thanks for any insight you might have.
Praying for a post-Olympics-surprise-speed-up…
LID: 4/17/06
July 22nd, 2008 at 8:02 pm
I just don’t “get” why folks absolutely REFUSE to accept what China is saying. Whether it’s a party line or not, it IS what they are saying. Hoping for a speed-up when they are SO clearly saying it’s NOT gonna happen is just… weird. IMO.
WHY do folks not believe what China says? And why would you want to adopt from a place you feel tells lies to you?
IMO it makes no difference whether we choose to believe what they say, or not - either way, it’s up to China to let out however many kids for international adoption THEY choose. If there are 10 million kids in orphanages or 10K - if they’re only letting out so many each year, that’s the way it’s going to be.
Insisting they “tell the truth” isn’t going to get anyone a baby any faster, or change the reality of what’s happening - China is referring out far fewer NSN kids than before, and far more SN kids. We can accept it as the reality it is, or continue to rail against “the lies” and bang our heads against the wall trying to figure out what they’ve told us again and again.
July 22nd, 2008 at 8:16 pm
Wait4ever, I feel like I could have written your post. All I can say is, I hear you, I feel your pain. It’s hard to even walk our dogs in the park at night because there are happy young families everywhere. And I hate pregnant ladies. Isn’t that awful? What bothers me the most is that they act like being pregnant is some personal accomplishment. Unless they’ve been through the fertility rigamarole, it isn’t an accomplishment! It’s luck. It’s winning the Darwinian lottery. I’m not saying this to make any of you who have biological children feel bad, or attacked. I’m just venting. (I don’t REALLY hate pregnant ladies– I just feel like I do.)
And lulubell, I really don’t see why adopting an American child would make me somehow more virtuous, which is what you seem to imply. By adopting from China I’ll be giving a home to a child who doesn’t have one. Why does it matter where she comes from? I don’t privelege the lives of Americans over the lives of people in other countries, and frankly, I think that kind of jingoistic nationalism is one of the reasons our country is reviled by the rest of the world right now. (I know RQ, no politics– so I’ll stop there.)
July 22nd, 2008 at 10:07 pm
Thank you RQ for your honest and heart felt post. It was much appreciated.
July 22nd, 2008 at 11:07 pm
My daughter’s SWI would look almost completely empty to an untrained eye. We learned only after the referral that almost all of the babies are in foster care. While my original referral stated she was in the orphanage, the update clarified that her time there had only been for three months.
Things are not always what they seem.
Laureen
http://www.babysites.com/sites/laureenmary
July 23rd, 2008 at 12:49 am
Wow RQ, you are a deep well and I think that you should too write a book! My situation was much like Jess’s and I felt such heart ache for the foster family that had to give her up. I know how much they loved her and they sent her to us with a red felt necklace that symbolized a blessing to her for her life. No other girls in our group had this with them. My daughter is beautiful and amazing but very learing of anyone who is not me, even close relatives. I am blessed beyond measure and thankful everyday but that anger bug does bit me in the butt once in a while about so many issues. What was her life like? Why does she exhibit that behavior? etc. Things that I will never know but as RQ said it best “can survive.”
THank you RQ for all you do for all of us.
Adomom
July 23rd, 2008 at 2:51 am
Thanks RQ for this discussion. It helps so much to share these feelings.
Waiting for our first child at 45yo is so hard. We cannot change from the NSN to SN program here in Australia, we cannot get pregnant while adopting (although that is not an option for us as we are infertile but it must be so hard to be on contraception during the whole wait like we were advised by our SW), and the one that really upsets me is that we cannot pursue concurrent adoptions whilst in an IA program. I have an official reply to that one from our Minister of Families which states:
Australia does not permit applicants to have concurrent applications to adopt in more than one country. This is because at the last Special Commission on the Practical Operation of The Hague Convention on Adoption (at the Hague in Sept. 2005), countries of origin discussed their need for receiving countries to limit the pressures placed on them, particularly since most countries of origin have limited capacity and resources.
This just leaves me cold.
We also have no domestic adoption program (through foster care) and would need to first become foster carers if we want to help a child in this country in foster care to have a stable and loving family. Unfortunately the system here is terrible (as people have described in the US). Children are “moved on” every couple of months for no reason, and are never allowed to attach to a foster carer. You are supposed to join in this system, and hope that you may get “permanent placement” of that child one day. We just couldn’t go through the trauma of being a part of this system - having a child you love taken away.
We feel totally detached from reality here - our options are SO limited! It does make you angry - I feel so helpless, just waiting. The China program with it’s long long wait is our only option to have a child. At the time we picked China it was because of all the reasons people have outlined here- it was supposed to be transparent, quick and efficient. We still have faith in the Program and hope hope hope!
Thanks again all for the opportunity to vent.
July 23rd, 2008 at 8:04 am
RQ,
Thank you so much for taking the time to post about this more. I read your first post and have been thinking about it for two days. I am in the “warm and fuzzy” period because I just recieved an LOA for a child with a special need who is in a Half the Sky Orphanage.
I understand completely your anger. I give you my support. I really did not understand too much that orphanages are really that full or that your daughter was so malnourished. I believed what’s being said. The perfect storm — abandonments down, domestic adoption up, orphanage directors not willing to make babies paper ready, China wanting to slow the program due to international perception, and I believe not wanting to cause a surge in more trafficking. I think in a lot of places the perfect storm is true — but obviously not all.
I did believe that there were less babies. Truly less babies. And that the babies were recieving better care.
Obviously, that was a bit niave. Children are still suffering. And what of all those special needs children “in the other building.” Granted they may be recieving great care. We don’t know. But I worry for them.
I wish I could reach out and give you a hug. You know your daughter suffered. And that’s incredibly heart breaking. I am so glad you shared these feelings. It’s been a bit of a dose of reality. While my child is supposedly in a “good” orphanage with a “good” director, it’s still an orphanage with limited limited resources.
Thank you for bearing your heart.
Hann23
July 23rd, 2008 at 8:24 am
It’s hard to understand the “anger” feelings unless/until you bring home a child with issues that would have been preventable with just a little more time or effort on the part of SOMEONE in the sending country.
My feelings have turned more to sadness, now that I am home for several years with my formerly malnourished non-speaking son. He looks and acts fine now…but there are so many little things—his speech was nonexistent because nobody talked TO him, just over his head and around him….he would hide chunks of food in his toybox, never really believing there would be enough…he hit his head and got a large bruise near his eye and did not cry because nobody ever came when he did cry.
With a lot of love and work and reading about these things we’ve overcome a lot, or rather, he has overcome a lot.
But these things still lurk in the shadows, you know? And as he grows and gets ready for school I wonder how all this early neglect will affect him and his life. I am sad now, more than angry, because love does not conquer all, and he’s always going to have some residual from the legal changes and politics that kept him in the orphanage for extra months while he was starving and waiting for a home (He’s not from China but the issues are similar).
What makes me angry are the legions of kids left behind, kids I saw every day whose faces still haunt me years later.
My son has me, but who do they have?
I extrapolate this to China, and to kids waiting, no matter the reason, despite the love of the caregivers, and it’s just plain sad.
July 23rd, 2008 at 10:03 am
There are a lot of people I am angry with, including myself we are two years and $8k less then when we first started and are now going back to intense medical intervention to have a child; and more money gone. We have a late 2006 LID and consider China a complete and utter loss.
Just a note on the domestic adoption side. I am incredibly angry with all those who put the welfare of adults before the welfare of children. That goes for goverment agencies who allow children to anguish without a permanent family while making perfectly good parents wait; so that their nation can save face, meet a quota, hold a global event-whatever it is. I also am angry with goverments like my own who will repeatedly return children to bad situations until they become nearly unadoptable. You want to fix the US system, terminate parental and birthfamily rights before a child’s 1st or at latest their 2nd birthday if multiple intervention has occured, IE two strikes and its over. You’d be amazed how fast fast foster care adoption would increase if PAP’s were given a fighting chance to give their children a somewhat normal future.
July 23rd, 2008 at 10:40 am
Opinions are like smiles and everyone has one and they are all different.
If this forum/ site is to be of value and balanced with facts and rumors and personal observations from a person who has adopted two children from China and her feelings and thoughts, it should also be open to sentiments and/ or opinions from others. Just because there is disagreement of one’s views, should they really be chased away from the site and/ or offering their thoughts.
Acceptance is key isn’t it.
My two cents for all the anger I read regarding the person who posted about domestic adoption. I’m sure that person is as heartbroken and frustrated with the perils of domestic adoption as so many are with China’s current IA.
Peace
July 23rd, 2008 at 11:35 am
“Someone asked yesterday if I think the program was slowed deliberately”
Look at the ages of referrals - for the most part most of the children are less than a year old and unless there is a crystal ball out there, no one knows what the situation is going to happen in the next two to three years let alone 6 months. This “slow down” started a long time ago with far more applications than children in the IA program.
I don’t doubt that some planned slow down has happened, but at the same time IA became a bloated business - almost a caricature of it self. The adoption agencies, who by all means had to see they were processing more applications than could be filled based on historical data, don’t have clean petty coats in this either.
As far as children being treated less than acceptable, that was done by individual persons - be it the SWI or foster parents that cared for that child. What the situations and resources were is unknown, and for every bad foster parent trying to make an extra 20 dollars a month or SWI worker doing the minimum, there are 20 that did the right thing.
Abandoned children are viewed by Chinese society much different than in our western view - they are truly undesirable and “classless” – what we consider neglect may not be viewed the same.
July 23rd, 2008 at 12:30 pm
I will probably get flamed big time for this but I totally believe that the slowdown was due to the “saving face” theory. I also believe that after the Olympics is over the will be a “speed up”. BUT it will be very, very, very, very gradual. I think we probably won’t even be able to detect the speed up at first. Probably our community’s number crunchers and statisticians will be the first to detect the gradual increase as they continue to track and graph the trends MONTHS after the Olympics have passed.
All types of adoption are filled with uncertainties, and positive, and negative aspects. People should not criticize others for their choices of programs. Most PAPs do not enter into adoption lightly, whatever their program choice.
July 23rd, 2008 at 12:32 pm
Wondering why my comment is awaiting moderation? When did I get moderated, and why? Don’t think I broke any rules or anything?
July 23rd, 2008 at 12:39 pm
Sherry, I don’t know for sure, but it seems that all comments are moderated. Some appear faster on the site than others…maybe based on the fact whether RQ is around to approve the comments or another mod is around? I have no idea..but i doubt its your specific comments…don’t hear or see any rules broken here….
July 23rd, 2008 at 1:06 pm
My comment also awaiting moderation? Don’t think I broke any rules.
July 23rd, 2008 at 1:27 pm
Sherry, I made the very first post to this blog and my comment had to await moderation. :)) I think only some comments get this message b/c of key words in them. I can guess right off which ones in mine made the system hold my comment. I think RQ has commented on this before maybe. Anyway, I think CTG is right in saying that your comment will eventually appear but not until RQ or maybe another mod. (not sure if they can approve or not) has a chance to review it. It does NOT mean you did anything wrong, just that you have a word or words in there that flagged your comment for moderation. Does this make any sense?:)
Hey I wonder if this will be flagged? :))
This has been a great forum of discussion. I have no thoughts on the slowdown as I just don’t have enough information. We have not traveled yet, but I know someone with a child from our daughter’s orphanage saw lots of kiddos several months back on her visit there. And MOST of the children are in foster care. I wonder about all of it from all angles. I cannot believe that abandonment has shifted THIS MUCH in such a short time though.
On foster care and domestic, same thing for us as many others. Our SW told us to forget domestic as we already have two children. She said foster care in our state requires the placed child to be the youngest and our youngest was not even 5 when we explored this option. She said it would be rare to get a placement younger than 4. We would have been open to siblings though. It is not always a simple answer.
For those of you waiting for your first child, I have said this before but I am sorry and just sending you a cyber-hug. I can’t imagine your pain and even losses you may have endured before this wait. I have not been there. For those of you waiting who began being told of very different wait times, again I have no real words but I am so sorry for all you are dealing with. We began this journey knowing we would do SN and knowing a realistic time frame once we received a referral and accepted it. I can’t imagine being told repeatedly one thing and seeing another come to fruition.
July 23rd, 2008 at 2:31 pm
china dad 1 said:
“What the situations and resources were is unknown, and for every bad foster parent trying to make an extra 20 dollars a month or SWI worker doing the minimum, there are 20 that did the right thing.”
I couldn’t agree more. I cannot ever thank my daughter’s foster parents enough. I was lucky enough to get back a camera full of pictures and hope one day to be able to express my gratitude for all the love, security and care they so obviously showered on my child from 3 months to 13 months old.
When I met the SWI director, I was taken aback. Having expected a middle-aged man, I was surprised to meet a warm, grandmotherly-type woman who made weekly visits to my daughter’s foster parents. I grabbed my paper with the (seemingly hundreds of) questions to ask her. When I turned back to her, her eyes were filled with tears as they moved back in forth from the computer screen (which had photos I had already uploaded onto my website) to my daughter sleeping in the crib. She started to weep and speak to me. My guide translated, “I can see that she is already deeply loved…. she is my favorite.”
Well, forget it. Needless to say, I didn’t get to “The Questions”. We hugged and I told her, “Thank you for loving my daughter and taking such good care of her.” We wept in each others arms, she went over to the crib, leaned over and kissed Isabel goodbye and then left. It was perhaps the most moving experience of my life.
I know I might be in the minority but I just wanted to express that some of these children are well-taken care of and loved beyond measure during their wait to come home.
Laureen
http://www.babysites.com/sites/laureenmary
July 23rd, 2008 at 3:42 pm
When I lost the spam word thingie after the last software upgrade I had to make the moderation rules a bit more strict. Some days the system catches 50+ spam comments. Unfortunately, it also sometimes catches 5 to 10 good comments that I have to let through.
July 23rd, 2008 at 4:29 pm
Mom2Isabel, thanks so much for sharing that! My daughters were loved, too.
As for why some people believe there are more children waiting than are made available, I think the suddenness and extremeness of the drop in referrals is one reason why we question the truth of what we’ve been told. Hearing mixed messages from people in China and seeing some full orphanges also lends toward questioning what, exactly, is going on. I believe abandonments are down and domestic adoption is up, but I also believe China is pushing to get more SN children adopted. I can’t say how the Olympics plays into the drop. And considering that all governments lie to project what they want people to believe, that doesn’t cause me to reject China as a place from which to adopt. It would adopt for the child–the government line wouldn’t matter to me. I do agree that China will do what it wants to, but it doesn’t hurt to vent. In the right forum, I think it’s healthy.
July 23rd, 2008 at 4:37 pm
I was quite unprepared and taken by surprise by the deep anger I felt after we received our daughter (2004, before the slowdown). It wasn’t directed really at anyone or anything, just angry at the world as I was looking at my daughter, struggling and fearful.
She came from an orphanage that I would classify as a good orphanage. She was clean and well fed, could have had one more bottle a day, but she wasn’t malnourished. But she just hadn’t had enough of the human contact and stimulation that she would have needed, as there wasn’t enough care takers for that. Things that should be a human right for every baby. I was just angry at the world for the unfairness for my daughter, the unfairness of being abandoned at such a young age, the unfairness of not receiving the love and care that she deserved, the unfairness of meeting the harsh world way before she ever should have had to. She should have had someone -someone to love her, someone to protect her, someone to take care of her - instead of being alone among lots of other babies. The anger has now subdued, but it’s still there, deep down.
July 23rd, 2008 at 5:03 pm
I’m angry because I spent time responding to this topic, and hasn’t been posted ;(
July 25th, 2008 at 9:44 am
RQ, this hits home in a big way right now. We are in China, and just visited our daughter’s orphanage. I am so angry. I am angry that my daughter has rickets, which could have been prevented by feeding her enough of an appropriate formula, or just bringing her outside. My daughter is barely charting on the growth charts, because she wasn’t given enough to eat. It will take a long, long time before I can come to terms with what happened to her. And even longer before I can forgive.