The immediate future – rumors for and against a speed up
We all know that the CCAA told multiple agencies and countries during their tour that things will pick up after the first of the year. Specifically, they will do 15 days at a time (or take two calendar months to do a LID month, there were several variations that said the same thing).
As I’ve noted before, it appears that in order to do 15 days at a time they will need to increase the number of NSN referrals issued per month in order to make that happen.
There has been a lot of speculation on whether this will happen. People remember that the CCAA has told agencies other things in the past that didn’t turn out to be true, and so there is a good deal of mis-trust about this statement.
I’ve received a few emails from people who claim to have special knowledge. Though they are a bit cryptic about their actual source, it appears from what little they do say, that their sources are probably different from each other. And yet they all have a few things in common. The most notable being that the 15 days per month are not going to happen. Putting them all together, I believe the main points are:
- The ceiling/quota next year will be even lower than this year (which is lower than last year’s ceiling/quota).
- The COA (which is part of the State Department?) is frowning on agencies that are trying to be vague about the wait times for China.
- Two weeks (15 days) of referrals will not happen. They may get close a few times, but do not expect it to happen on a regular basis.
- The Special Needs Program is now the primary focus, and they are trying to ramp the NSN program down as quickly as possible without it becoming a media event or having an outcry about human rights issues.
What does this mean?
I don’t know. I have people with “special insider information” saying both things – that the ceiling/quota is going to be higher next year from some and that it will go down yet again from others. The supposed sources for the good news seems to be agencies and facilitators and for the not-so-good news seems to mostly be from U.S. official channels. How would our State Department or USCIS or COA know these things? I don’t know.
Also, at least two agencies seem to be basing their speed up statements on the fact that they know that the CCAA is has matched their clients pretty far out ahead of time. As I’ve said before, I’m sure that the CCAA is matching some families far ahead of time, but I don’t know that they have matched everyone ahead of time. I have some circumstantial evidence from the most recent batch that tells me that they are not matching everyone early. I don’t know anything for sure, but if I’m correct on that then at least two agencies are basing their speed up hopes on incomplete information. Just because the CCAA has matched their families pretty far in advance, it does not mean the CCAA has matched all families so far in advance.
One thing I have heard quite a bit of that seems to be in agreement from all sides: Current SN vs NSN consulate appointments seem to be more SN than NSN. Also, many agencies (not all agencies, many agencies) are reporting that they are now sending more families to China to complete a SN adoption than they are in the NSN program. I believe that at this time the SN program is bigger than the NSN program. Not in terms of dossiers, of course, but in terms of children actually being adopted each month. (As a side note, the State Department numbers should be out soon for the fiscal year just ended, it will be interesting to see what those numbers say. I wish they broke them down by program, but I guess we take what we can get at this point.)
I believe that December is about 60% the size of November. I also believe that the CCAA should be able to get through December in three months (with maybe a few December LIDs included in a fourth month that would be mostly made up of January LIDs). This assumes that they continue to do about the same number of NSN referrals per calendar month as they have been doing. If they increase that number then it could be less than three months, if they reduce that number even more, then, well, I don’t want to go there.
As far as speed up rumors, let’s look at a bit of history. Over the past two years we have had at least two big events where we were SURE things were going to speed up in the next month or two. First there was the promise last summer that the CCAA didn’t want the wait to go over a year. We were certain things would speed up since we were so close to that year mark – and even when we hit the year mark there were agencies saying it wouldn’t go over 14 months, that the CCAA was working hard to keep the wait from continueing to grow. I believed them, as did many others.
Then, last fall we had the combined rumor of new SWI’s being added to the IA program in the spring plus Brian Stuy’s statement last September that we were currently at the longest wait times. And then there was the waiting dad with a December of ’05 LID who asked the CCAA director face to face when he would get his referral and was told December. (We all thought it meant last December, none of us thought it was possible it would be the following December.)
So last fall we were all pretty much believing things would speed up, which didn’t happen. And then came January ’07 and they put the brakes on even more.
There was also the rumor from agencies that the CCAA wasn’t going to let the wait get to the point where people would have to redo their I-171H, but the CCAA later made it pretty clear that they were not concerned about that and if we didn’t like it we should look to our government to change, not to them to shorten the wait.
More recently I’ve had correspondence from people who apparently believed Bob C on APC back in June when he promised that a ceiling would be reached on the waiting time over the summer. Though I don’t think that was a big event, just a few dozen people who hung their hat (and hopes) on his words.
So where does this leave us now? We’ve basically been promised (again) that things are going to pick up a bit. Soon. And this time we are hearing it from the CCAA (told to multiple agencies and governments over the summer) as well as agencies continueing to get this word now from the CCAA. Some of us interpret the CCAA’s statement to governments and agencies to mean this next batch (since we are through with November) and some people interpret it to mean the batch to arrive in December (the first batch of the CCAA’s next fiscal year) and some people interpret it to mean the batch to arrive in January (since that’s the first of 2008). And many of us feel like Charlie Brown and the football – not going to fall for it again. But then, hope springs eternal, and maybe they are telling the truth this time and the football won’t be yanked away yet again.
To summarize:
- We know that if things stay exactly the same then LID days per batch should increase because we know there aren’t as many people logged in during the next few months.
- We’ve been promised 15 days at a time (two months to do one month, etc), which would seem to mean an increase in the number of referrals per month.
- There are rumors out there that the ceiling/quota will indeed be higher next year, which means maybe they are going to pull it off.
- There are also rumors that the ceiling/quota next year will be lower, which would be very very very bad.
- We may know this month, or next month, but at the latest we should know by the January batch whether this rumored speed up is going to happen.
There are dozens of theories of why things may be about to speed up. This blog post is too long as it is, so I’m not going to go there.
October 9th, 2007 at 3:42 pm
All I can say is that I love the Charlie Brown analogy:
AAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!
October 9th, 2007 at 3:46 pm
My gut tells me that there won’t be a significant speed up ever. Maybe stabalize at 3 years or so and eventually China will just do SN. My hope is that other needy countries, like India, get a good IA program started and more people can turn there for a good, reliable IA program.
October 9th, 2007 at 3:47 pm
RQ,,
Thank you for all you do….
I think the CCAA “leaks” info of what they want us to hear, rather it is the truth or not… That way, we still have no idea what is really going…. Sorry to be so negative, I am not happy with the CCAA at this point…
October 9th, 2007 at 4:00 pm
Uuuuuuuuugggggghhhhhh!! That’s all I have to say!
October 9th, 2007 at 4:03 pm
As I read this I felt like a balloon….slowly….losing…air….to finally….FLAT! But no ill will to the messenger, thanks RQ…
sign me,
deflated!
October 9th, 2007 at 4:05 pm
Well, I’ll ignore my gut and brain and let my heart do the talking. Although not very smart on my part, I still hold on to hope for a speed up.
RQ-What are some of the theories behind the speed up?
October 9th, 2007 at 4:06 pm
Hope springs eternal. Remember, Charlie Brown has never given up on his desire to be able to kick the football. Maybe “Lucy” (the CCAA) will finally play nice and let Charlie Brown’s dream come true.
October 9th, 2007 at 4:06 pm
You are truly what I look forward to each day RQ! Thanks for your time, energy and thoughtful insight. You are always careful to let us all know that nobody, truly nobody knows what is going to happen except those in power at the CCAA. I will say a prayer for all of us so China picks up the pace and we can bring our daughters (and sons) home!
October 9th, 2007 at 4:12 pm
Have we really been “promised” a speed-up or did the CCAA just say that they hoped it would happen?
My agency (which didn’t meet with the CCAA this summer that I know of) is not promising a speed up or even mentioning it as a possibility for people to pin their hopes on.
October 9th, 2007 at 4:19 pm
Thanks for the long post that summed up a lot of areas. My brain doesn’t even want to wrap my head around even lower numbers. I have been home since August 1st, but I have friends behind me :)
October 9th, 2007 at 4:21 pm
Sounds like you have been doing a lot of research there–with some very interesting sources.
I don’t know if the State Dept has the ability to break their visa numbers into NSN vs. SN. Is there anything in the visa paperwork where one indicates what program they are in? (I don’t recall that.)
Thanks for all that you are doing!
October 9th, 2007 at 4:27 pm
For someone whose LID is 4/13/07 this is all pretty overwhelming. No, we were not originally told our wait could be over 3 years (or maybe 4, 5 etc.) I constantly wonder what should we do? We have talked about switching to special needs and was never really opposed to the idea although we did believe there were many NSN children in China that needed a home. One of my fears is that everyone will want to switch and we would be in the same predicament. In my heart I want to stay where I am and hope there is a child that needs us. What do othrs with the same LID feel?
October 9th, 2007 at 4:30 pm
Some times i don’t wan’t to hear bad new’s and this is that time.Do we ever get a second child from China? Our daugther talk’s about it every day and ask when, when etc.
14 feb.LID
October 9th, 2007 at 4:33 pm
Very detailed post – thank you RQ! Plenty of information to come to our own conclusions, but can you please please just tell me what is going to happen? (joking of course – sort of).
October 9th, 2007 at 4:34 pm
I ,saw that i was forgetting to say the year LID 14 Feb.2006.
October 9th, 2007 at 4:43 pm
As someone in a country that doesn’t have a Waiting Child programme and getting a Special Needs match direct from the CCAA is a nightmare of bureaucracy, this is very very worrying.
URGH!
gertiesquidge
UK DTC 10th August 2007
http://offtochinaoneday.blogspot.com/
October 9th, 2007 at 4:46 pm
With an LID of 01-27-06 we have grown to the point of acceptance of knowing we have zero control of our adoption process. The “Wait” is what it is. So we wait. We’re not wearing rose colored glasses. We’re not looking at a glass half full or half empty. Some days we smile when we feel like crying but it’s not an entirely fake smile. Only because we know that eventually we will hold our little one.
We hope and pray things will speed up. For everyone. All the while, we prepare ourselves for will be… It’s tough. Our love is tougher.
October 9th, 2007 at 4:53 pm
Good grief. When did you need a Doctorate in China adoption to figure all this out?!?!? Thank goodness for RQ. I feel like I’m getting the “china adoption for dummies” version here, and even that is to mind boggling for me!! LOL
I hope, hope, hope, that some sort of speed up happens! And soon. Like next batch soon. Come on December!
October 9th, 2007 at 5:05 pm
The only thing I can say is time will tell …
Ray xxx.
October 9th, 2007 at 5:06 pm
I’ve been trying to remain optimistic but this is all quite horrifying. With my login date of 4/27/07, I can’t help but feel that I was duped into proceeding with my adoption plans. I broached the topic with my agency MONTHS ago of switching to a SN adoption to expedite things, and they discouraged me, saying that’s not a reason for doing SN. I am a single mom (have a bio child, age 7 1/2, thank God for her) and will be 49 SOON so one of my biggest concerns is how insanely old I will be when I finally bring home my baby! But experience is the best teacher, and the experience to date has been nothing short of deeply, deeply discouraging about the timetable for adoptions. I have been trying to keep my spirits up, but I am so upset by this analysis that I could just cry.
It is hard to fathom how there could not be enough NSN babies to adopt. How do you go from million of babies in orphanages to none at all????
October 9th, 2007 at 5:12 pm
thank you for the summary. I would be soooo excited if Dec “only” took 3 mos, I’ve been mentally planning for 4, let’s just hope the quota doesn’t decrease (ugh). This wait is awful for everyone.
October 9th, 2007 at 5:13 pm
Could they make this a little more stressfull? With an LID of 1/19/06 can we hope for a child in 08!
October 9th, 2007 at 5:18 pm
GAWD this makes my head spin i wished that i had been wrong all along but it apears to me i’m not it’ll be 6-7 days or lower from now on.
October 9th, 2007 at 5:33 pm
I just do not understand what China is trying to do? Very, very sad for everyone, the children and the waiting parents. I am hoping for the best, which at this point I still don’t know what that could be, and preparing for the worst, which always happens anyway!
12.14.05
http://www.ramellafamily.blogspot.com
October 9th, 2007 at 5:35 pm
RQ-
COA is the Council on Accreditation which is one of the entities which handles agency licensing under the Hauge laws. They are one of the recognized accrediting bodies and sort of a “gatekeeper” for the State Department- http://www.coanet.org
They are not part of the State Department.
Or do you mean the Bureau of Consular Affairs which is the division of the state department which runs the consulates (including guangzhou) and issues the visas?
Thanks.
October 9th, 2007 at 5:39 pm
I really wonder how the agencies (especially the China-only ones) can continue to make business decisions with such uncertainty. I assume their sincere goal is to find homes for orphans AND to help families adopt children. They can’t feel very good at this point about signing up families for what may be a fruitless effort. I guess the China program as we knew it in 2005 was too good to be true. When we decided to adopt from China I remember hoping we could encourage another family to do the same one day. Now I warn people off.
LID 12/19/2005
October 9th, 2007 at 5:40 pm
KH,
We have a LID 4/16/07 and are in the same boat. We struggle with the decision to switch programs. Guatamale is having troubles and all the jummping ship from the China program has increased waits in Korea, Vietnam and others. We have invested so much time, hope and finances into China that I do not want to switch. I also feel like I am abandoniing our daughter. Hard choices. We are not sure what to do either.
October 9th, 2007 at 5:47 pm
PurpleMonkey, would be it more appropriate to say they fall under the jurisdiction of the State Department. It seems clear that the State Department created the COA, I’m just not sure how closely they are still working with each other.
Rich – I’m not saying it will be 6 or 7 days from now on. I don’t know what it will be. If they decrease the ceiling/quota then yeah, it could be. But if it stays the same it will be slightly more days than that on average, and if it goes up then it could be 15 days at a time. That was part of the point here, we just don’t know what the CCAA plans to do next.
October 9th, 2007 at 6:01 pm
RQ–I’m wondering (with a March 07 LID) if/when you think that attrition is going to start to make a major difference for NSN. I know the idea has been that it won’t really make a big difference, but I see people dropping out right and left, not to mention those moving to SN and getting their babies a lot sooner. In my agency LID group we have 3 families who have openly stated that they are giving the CCAA another “couple of months” and if there’s not an appreciable speedup, they will be out for good. In other words, I only see the attrition rate going up, up, up, and I’m wondering if in your opinion (or in your magical crystal ball) attrition is ever going to make a real difference in speeding things up.
October 9th, 2007 at 6:10 pm
Thanks RQ. This is so much to digest, and I so appreciate you compliling all this info. Is anyone else wondering why China continues to accept NSN dossier(s)? Is it because they don’t want to come right out and say, “sorry NSN program closed”? I have been waiting a year, and I have at least 2-3 more to wait. Not knowing how this is going to end is killing me.
October 9th, 2007 at 6:14 pm
Of course I am hoping, hoping, hoping, for a speed up. However, at this point, I think I’d be happy if it just didn’t slow down any further. :(
October 9th, 2007 at 6:16 pm
Following the Charlie Brown analogy, Charlie Brown did succeed in kicking the football once, and only once. That time, someone other than Lucy was holding the football! So, unless there is a major shake up in the management of CCAA, I’m remaining skeptical.
October 9th, 2007 at 6:37 pm
Oh dear..this is very discouraging….Hard to say for sure…Thanks so much RQ for trying to make sense of things…
October 9th, 2007 at 6:43 pm
I read this blog daily, but as a lurker to say the least. I adopted 10 years ago and cannot adopt again–say, too old, single, and surviving metastatic breast cancer (who knows for how long)! If I feel like you all are being jerked around blindfolded by the CCAA, I can only imagine how you feel. So many of you are so much more gracious than I would be and yet, with the hopes, dreams and prayers for a baby at the end of your wait, I can understand why. I think it makes me all the angrier, believing that the CCAA reads this blog and other sites and does everything in their power to make sure that they know that we know that they are powerful. I think their adoption trips to this country make agencies look like they are groveling at their feet. And grovel they do. And since truth isn’t a virture in China, the CCAA can say whatever they want. I don’t believe a word they say. It makes me really sad to think that they are sitting at their desks smiling at the end of every month to see how miserable they have managed to make so many families. They should be so thrilled at having matched babies to families that they cannot wait to post the date of referrels they have mailed. Anything other than that is loathsome. Someone said that they wondered if agencies in this country had complained about them posting it. If an agency cannot plan to manage the phone calls of thrilled, excited, waiting moms-and-dads-to-be once they see the date, I would be more than sick that I had paid them to be my adoption advocate. And you probably guessed it: I wonder every day about some of the agencies doing IA. Enough of my rant. Just please know that I keep all who wait to be families (moms, dads, sibs, and orphans) in my prayers.
October 9th, 2007 at 6:55 pm
Just some info for those considering switching to SN and hoping for a faster referral –
We all know that this is not a “good” reason for switching. Having said that, we thought long and hard about 16 months ago when we realized that many of the SN kids have truly minor (wouldn’t be considered SN in the US) issues and also realized that really all children are SN in some way or another.
Long story short, we switched to SN in August ’06 with a very limited list of problems that we are able to accept and received a referral a couple of weeks ago.
I’m not trying to encourage or discourage anyone from switching to SN – just wanted to provide some information regarding the wait for them also.
Jen
October 9th, 2007 at 7:00 pm
Not feeling optimistic at all… RQ, thanks for the thorough rundown. I really appreciate it- bad news and all… ;)
5/06
October 9th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
I am just hoping the ceiling does NOT go lower!
October 9th, 2007 at 8:02 pm
RQ, thanks so much for all that you do. I don’t know how you find the time! But we all appreciate your dedication to this community.
October 9th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
With that mass of contradictions, we really don’t know anything at all except that something may change, . . . . . . or it may not.
About 30 years ago, my neighbors wanted to adopt an infant (newborn) domestically. They did all the paperwork with a highly recommended social service agency in the midwest. After everything was in order, the caseworker told them to go home and wait – don’t do the nursery, just get along with life, as the normal wait was 5 to 7 YEARS!! Kind of makes this seem not so bad.
October 9th, 2007 at 8:42 pm
All I want is to be a mom, I feel it all just slipping away. With a LID of 3/24/06, if the worst holds true, then it will possibly be more than a year before referral. Honestly some days I don’t know how much more I can take…
October 9th, 2007 at 8:45 pm
Ford, I know exactly how you feel. we have an LID of 1-27-06 also. The wait has been sooo hard! We have learned that we have no choice but to take it day by day. some days are better than others, some days I just stay in bed especially to avoid the (when are you getting your baby?) questions, which I know are well intentioned. DH and I really feel with all our hearts and souls that China is where our DD has always been waiting for us. I will wait for as long as it takes. At least I know We are closer than what we were.
My heart goes out to all who wait!
Melinda
waiting for Savannah
October 9th, 2007 at 8:56 pm
I have a couple of questions after reading this post:
1. Is there anything that we can do? Can we start a group that will lobby to our government? Can we write a letter requesting truthful information from the Chinese Government (not CCAA)? Can we call attention by contacting the media? Can we form a group to lobby the agencies here? Or should we feel completely in the dark and hopeless? Mind you, I am not saying that we could change China’s mind about what they are doing, but could we get them to simply be truthful AND forthcoming with information?
2. Does the CCAA really read this site? If they do, why? Why would they be concerned about what we are saying, and then they DO what they please?
3. If China really only wants to refer MOSTLY SN, what would be wrong with them coming out and saying that?
My “Charlie Brown” experience with changing lines (in the store and on the highway anyway) is that as soon as I change lines, the line I used to be in speeds up, and my new current line becomes the slowest one! ( Go ahead everybody, tell me to get out of the line, so that it will speed up).
RQ~ if you were giving advice to a really good friend (Me), would you tell me to wait a year and see what is happening before swithcing programs?
October 9th, 2007 at 9:01 pm
RQ, I am relatively new to the site so please forgive me if this has been addressed already and I missed it. This certainly strikes me as a human rights issue. How do we address it in those terms? Are there any movements already working on it? Can a group like Human Rights Watch get involved? Surely the fact that government bureaucracy is standing between children in orphanages and families who want to give them homes should be producing more public outcry and action.
October 9th, 2007 at 9:05 pm
Ford, I know exactly how you feel. we have an LID of 1-27-06 also. The wait has been sooo hard! We have learned that we have no choice but to take it day by day. some days are better than others, some days I just stay in bed especially to avoid the (when are you getting your baby?) questions, which I know are well intentioned. DH and I really feel with all our hearts and souls that China is where our DD has always been waiting for us. I will wait for as long as it takes. At least I know We are closer than what we were.
waiting for Savannah
October 9th, 2007 at 9:11 pm
I was having problems posting. I apologize for the double posts.
October 9th, 2007 at 9:21 pm
Someday they will write a book about this, how the wait grew and grew, I just hope it has a happy ending
October 9th, 2007 at 9:22 pm
This is my first post, though I’ve been lurking for months. RQ, you and the work you do with this site ROCK! Thank you. I’ve been waiting for years to be a mother and am prepared to wait longer (LID 7/24/06), but my biggest fear is that the CCAA will shut down the NSN program altogether before I am allowed to bring my daughter home. Am I worrying needlessly? Can you offer any words of comfort? I can wait but I would be devastated to find out that I am waiting for nothing.
October 9th, 2007 at 9:39 pm
I don’t have a crystal ball. I wish I knew the answer to these questions, but I don’t.
I do not believe that China is going to shut the program down. I think that those who stick it out are going to eventually get a referral. They would not have bothered with the new regulations if they were just going to shut it down, those regulations were designed to slow things down so the program can be sustained.
As far as whether to stick it out or go elsewhere, I can’t answer that for anyone.
———-
To the people wanting to take some kind of action – I wish it were so easy. China does not take kindly to pressure. Ever. Most likely the result of any pressure towards China about this, would just be to slow things down even more. That means even less babies being matched with families.
And, even if we did contact human rights groups – what could they do? They’d never get near the inside of an orphanage that the Chinese government didn’t want them inside of. Most SWI’s that allow parents to visit do not allow pictures to be made of any of the babies that are there, so there is likely not much recent pictorial evidence. Without proof, what could they do? And even with proof, what could they do except make China clamp down even more? And probably stop allowing families to visit orphanages at all.
October 9th, 2007 at 9:40 pm
I was just wondering, on the CCAA site they list a phone number and address, has anyone ever called them directly? I’m not planning on it, but just curious if anyone ever had.
I read in a previous post here that a dad spoke to the CCAA face to face.
October 9th, 2007 at 9:42 pm
Jen, was that August of 07 that you put in your request for an SN Child? Wow! that is fast.
My DH and I are adding our name to the SN list also. We almost dropped out this summer but my sister-in-law urged us to take another look at the SN program. We discussed it again and decided to go for it (after doing alot of research). We are an older, childless couple and we know there are beautiful children in both programs so we are very excited.
On another note..I feel so bad for everyone on this chatroom and everyone that is waiting. It is heartbreaking to hear news like this but at least we are hearing something. Who knows what will really happen.
Sharingthejoy, thank you so much for being there to support us. My prayers are with you.
I’m wondering if China wants us to get discouraged so that we will drop out?
And maybe there is some truth to the rumor that the SN program is being ramped up (particularly now that the olympics are edging closer and closer).
Only time will tell.
October 9th, 2007 at 10:04 pm
Can anyone address the question of what has become of all the non-special-needs babies? Is the population of NSN children needing a home really declining rapidly? Is there a reliable estimate of what it is?
I have been giving myself till yearend to research SNs so that I can make an informed decision early in the year about whether to switch. I don’t want to complete an adoption until I am covered by FMLA on my new job, which puts me to May 2008 before I WANT to finish. But part of me just wants to hold out for a NSN baby.
October 9th, 2007 at 10:06 pm
AfamilyforAudrey5-
I think I’ve heard rumors that people have done that before. It won’t go well…remember, CCAA doesn’t have a relationship with us – they have a relationship with our agencies. And if you are asking a question of someone you shouldn’t be asking a question of, they probably won’t feel a need to give you a truthful answer.
As to people wanting to “call to arms.” Obviously, what RQ said is sooo right. But, what good will come of it? No one can prove anything – access is and will be denied. What? Because a few of our senators call and complain to the embassy, the policy is going to change?? Not likely. It will just spur another round of Paula Zahn – type – misinformational – soundbit – tv – sensationalist – news – “articles”.
More media bs is soooo not what we need for this program.
And CCAA will only tell us what they want to tell us. We can’t demand that they tell us what they don’t want to tell us.
October 9th, 2007 at 11:10 pm
RQ
Appreciate the post greatly. I do think this needs an astrix next to it however. The ages of children being placed NSN is getting younger. We have no way of being able to predict the number of avilable childen for placement out more than 3- 4 months as it takes a couple of months to get a child paper ready -and we are seeing 6 month old being refered.
October 9th, 2007 at 11:27 pm
RQ
Your information on the various aspects of the China program has given our family comfort over this long wait. I feel very blessed to have our LID so close (12-5-2005) and hopefully we will get our referral next month. Lily’s room has been waiting for over two years, as our young son gave up his room right after we sent our paperwork to China – over two years ago. At that time the wait was 6 months.
It is hard to believe that the one month that was lost on the scheduling of our last home visit has now developed into almost an additional wait of 9 months. I feel so down for the families that have LIDs in late 2006 and 2007. I only hope the waitimes get shorter and more children can find loving homes.
Agian thank you for all you do for waiting families — you give us all faith.
October 9th, 2007 at 11:37 pm
I’ve never posted here before, but been reading daily for awhile. Here’s a theory of mine. Could it be that China may want to increase the SN program, and decrease the NSN program, because it costs less (in theory) to raise and care for a NSN child? If this was a better situation fiscally, couldn’t they then improve the quality of care for those that are in the orphanages indefinately? Wouldn’t these children that age out of the orphanges also help the problem with the lack of marriagable females? Just a thought.
October 9th, 2007 at 11:44 pm
Wow. Thanks for that great bit of info RQ. It’s a lot to take in.
I sense much frustration today (but what else is new right?) and it makes my heart ache for all of us.
One thing seems to run common – we all expected one time frame of waiting when we started, and ended up by LID and wait to match with a completely new time frame – that of things getting much longer than we expected!
How sad is that?
I just don’t understand what is going on with the CCAA. Why would they want to be known as the IA program with a 3 year (or more) wait?! Who wants that kind of reputation?
I hope they speed up for everyone’s sanity, including mine.
October 9th, 2007 at 11:58 pm
I believe the CCAA is trying to ramp up the SN program and to simply raise the NSN girls to the best of their ability within the SWI so that there won’t be a big difference in male to female ratio in the years to come. Look at the possibilities of not having enough females for their men. Worse case scenario, it could lead to a civil war. China has always looked far into their future by hundreds of years. They have to be realizing that fewer girls for the excess boys are problematic. What is their solution. I know this is quite political in thought but is where my head is with the push for SN. Do they simply want to keep the NSN girls around for the future of their country?
Just food for thought.
I personally believe we will all get our referrals and those already logged in will get NSN if that is what they asked for if they are just willing to wait these awful wait times.
What is everyone else’s take on this theory?
October 10th, 2007 at 12:31 am
Even during the best of years they only adopted about 10K girls out of the country. This number will in no way impact the male to female ratio seen in China. There are other programs that would be far more effective (like allowing two children per family if one is a girl).
I believe this is just plain old politics and bureaucracy.
October 10th, 2007 at 2:20 am
I agree with you seeinglilybugs. We all know that the WHO does not believe that any child benefits from being raised in an institution, that this has very negative effects on their emotional and sometimes mental and physical developement has been proven. Which is why orphanages do not exist as a long term solution to caring for children without families in wealthy first world countries. The problem China faces re the number of girls to boys ratio can be easily solved by allowing families to have the number of children they wish to have. It is not international adoption that is the problem. There are so many children in orphanages in China that need loving families and obviously not enough Chinese parents who want these children. It really upsets me when some people and especially the media start saying things like ” people adopting from China are supporting the one child policy and making the situation worse.” Yes we have actually had people say that to us. Maybe this is what China wants the world to believe..that we are the problem, not their government policies. Sorry to be so upset and post such a long rant. I’m so sick of all the intellectualising that goes on about adoption. A child needs love and nurture, of the one to one kind, that means parents, family a home that is forever. No institution can ever replace that. For China to keep these girls as some sort of insurance against their population vs economic policies, rather than allow for these girls to be adopted, to be loved and given everything that any child that is born to loving parents has a right to,would be such an evil calculating act. All the financial support that goes to orphanages in China mostly comes from adoptive families, adoption organisations and those waiting for their children. What a horrible irony if it was the financial aid from the adoption community that ended up being the facilitator of less and less NSN children actually being adopted.
cab
October 10th, 2007 at 2:46 am
By doing what they are doing…. I cannot see how the CCAA are fulfilling the requirements under the Hague. How can calculation, political manipulation and withholding be in the best interests of the child. I wander if anyone has the ability to do a study on the girls that eventually “graduate” out of long term ( 18yrs) of institutionalisation. If when we get our daughter this will be one blessing she will not have to worry about. I will wait and wait and wait for how ever long it takes to not only build my family, but I know in my heart it will be one less child they can play chess with.
If its a game they want to play, 2 can play!! Grrrrrrr yes I am angry today.
Cab2 interesting scenario about how our fund raising could be the catalist.
October 10th, 2007 at 3:35 am
One of the agencies in my country just reportet on their web site that the slowdown in China is due to domestic adoption. They tell us that the rate of domestic adoptions is 3 times higher than for IA adoptions.
Is this true?
Beate
LID Dec 8 2005
October 10th, 2007 at 6:00 am
Hey Beate:
Somewhere, either here or in the Forum, someone posted about the 2005 numbers being about 8,000 children adopted internationally and 25,000 domestic. If these numbers are true, then what that agency said sounds about right. Maybe the poster was also quoting that agency; I can’t remember. We’ll know more when the 2006 numbers come out – and yes, I am very aware that the numbers represent humans, children, babies. Painfully aware.
Judi LID 9/2006
October 10th, 2007 at 6:47 am
RQ -
Regarding the COA and State Department (sorry it took me so long to get back to you on this but I wanted to be sure I got it right).
You said “it seems clear that the State Department created the COA” and I don’t think that is correct. COA has been around for decades and previously worked with states to regulate adoption agencies and even other social services (e.g. rehab) at the state level.
http://www.coastandards.org/about.php
I think that we could say that COA is the “enforcer” of the State Department standards for the Hauge. They also accredit agencies in some provinces in Canada which has nothing to do with the U.S. State Department. What has happened within the last year or so is that COA was designated as the only entity to do ALL the of the Hauge Treaty accreditations by the State Department and they hired a huge number of social workers to work as accreditors for this program. But COA still does all that work and accreditation for other situations that have nothing to do with State or the Hague.
The whole point of State farming out the process to COA was that they have been in business for 20+ years and I think COA is heavily advising/directing State on standards for agencies. But I am sure it is a two way street.
For our purposes, it may be a distinction without a difference?
PM
October 10th, 2007 at 6:48 am
Banany, Thanks for your comments. It’s nice to hear from others in the same boat.. The unknown is the hardest. We’ll keep hanging in there. I know there is a daughter for us out there.
October 10th, 2007 at 7:04 am
My feeling is they are fulfilling a quota for IA adoptions and they have not been forthcoming about this number. Recently I queried my adoption agency and they said the CCAA admitted to them that the wait could go from 3-4 years. I recently went back and looked at a letter from our adoption agency director (It was written December 2006). This letter seems to really be highlighting everything that we are hearing and seeing today.
–more special needs
–more domestic adoptions
–fewer IA adoptions
–longer waits
I am really having second thoughts about continuing on with China, with a Sept. 2006 LID, I anticipating waiting 2-3 more years from right now.
_________________________________________________
Here is an excerpt from the letter:
The abandonment of children has been declining since 2003. Most children who were abandoned before were for gender. Now they were abandoned for medical reasons. For example, one orphanage accepted 15 children from the police in the past two months; there was only one healthy infant.
Before 2003, the registered domestic adoption was about one third of the total adoptions. From what I heard on this trip, it could be ten times the international adoptions in 2006. In one province I visited, there are 5,000 registered domestic adoptions and only about 280 international adoptions. Half of the international adoptions were for special needs children. I visited a big city orphanage, 95% of the children there have special needs. For the 150 healthy children, there are more than 700 Chinese families in line waiting for them. The orphanage directors answered my concern: Yes, some families were picky and annoying but most of them are good families!
The new Chinese adoption policies simply reflect the change in the Chinese society and the change world-wide. The foreign applicants tripled in number in the last two years and CCAA has about 20,000 families waiting for assignments. The new policies seem to be harsh but CCAA officials told me the bar was still much lower than many other countries. Also, the new regulations do not apply to families with dossiers in China already logged in before May 1 of 2007!
October 10th, 2007 at 7:20 am
Hi skye06 and AmyfromMaine,
Thank your for the very interesting info. I really was not aware of the huge amount of domestic adoptions.
And of course, with thise DA numbers, it seems quiet logical that there will be almost only SN children available for IA.
Beate
LID 12/8-2005
October 10th, 2007 at 7:51 am
RQ, Thanks for all the info. I check in with the site about three to four times a week to see if there is any good news on the horizon. It appears there is none. If the CCAA wants people to switch to SN from NSN why don’t they just say so instead of making us draw our own conclusions?
October 10th, 2007 at 8:38 am
Regarding contacting the CCAA, I’ve been recently thinking about the letter that was sent to the CCAA by a group of FCC chapters. The letter asked for clarification on the reasons behind the new restrictions that went into effect on 5/1/07, and the CCAA did send a gracious response to that letter. In some ways I wish that that opportunity would have been used to ask about the backlog of dossiers, rather than the new restrictions. To me, the reasoning behind the new restrictions is fairly obvious – to reduce the number of applications coming in. But there are many questions that do not have obvious answers, such as, what does the CCAA plan to do practically about the backlog, so that wait times do not increase to 3, 4, 5+ years? Is there a quota, and what is it? How many NSN files do they receive monthly from the SWI’s? and questions such as these. With that opportunity of sending a letter to the CCAA, I wish that these things would have been addressed, instead of the new restrictions. I think it’s more than fair to ask for at least some answer to these questions.
October 10th, 2007 at 8:40 am
I don’t think it’s all about trying to get people to switch to SN. In fact CCAA has made adopting through the SN program more difficult than ever before. The new requirements, other than family size, are being enforced to the letter. This has disqualified all singles–and singles used to account for a very significant percentage of SN-program parents. Also the new requirement that you can’t adopt a child off another agency’s list has really put a damper on SN adoptions. It used to be that many agencies were willing to work together to get a child home to a family but now CCAA doesn’t allow that. The timeframe from LID-travel for SN adoptions has also lengthened considerably as families’ dossiers are being scrutinized incredibly strictly–and if your dossier gets questioned in review, you can expect to wait a very, very long time for travel.
A lot of SN kids’ files are getting returned to CCAA unmatched because all the strict new rules exclude many families who would otherwise have been willing to adopt these kids. It’s a shame.
So I don’t think this points to CCAA wanting everyone to switch over to SN.
October 10th, 2007 at 8:45 am
Not holding my breath
October 10th, 2007 at 8:48 am
I agree with you 100% 3Time. Restrictions have been placed on both types of families – those requesting NSN and those requesting SN, all in an effort to reduce the overall number of applications coming in.
October 10th, 2007 at 9:03 am
Would the annoucment on the CCAA page dated september 26th 2007 have anything to do with the review room? I got a litteral translation from Bable fish and from what A couple of people in one of my groups could put togeather it seemed like there was a new influx of staff startting at the CCAA? This and the statement that all the orphanages are open to IA Could mae some change in numbers? Thanks M
October 10th, 2007 at 9:43 am
Even with domestic adoption up…there’s still a lot of unaccounted for babies. China has 1.3 billion people. UNICEF puts births in China at 1.74 million. There are, sadly, “plenty” of children still in orphanages. I have heard estimates every year of something from 50,000 to 100,000 abandoned babies a year. No one really knows, I don’t think. Many are taken in by family.
Also, remember, the one child policy is not absolute. There are many exceptions to it. For example, if both parents are products of the one child policy, they are allowed to have 2 children.
The amount of children referred out to IA, if it is 5000 a year or 15000 a year, is minimal to the overall Chinese state when it comes to: male/female ratio (also, many of these children are undesireable as mates), cost of raising these children, relative income to the Chinese state etc…(yes, that last one is a big number, but not for a government).
Keeping these children is not helping nor hindering the state in any way. Except for when it comes to their perception of what they should be doing, and what they perceive the outside world’s viewpoint.
October 10th, 2007 at 9:51 am
One other thing I wanted to say, then I’ll get off my soapbox: :)
Yes, by the Hague protocols, we (IA parents to be) are the “last resort”…keep the child in the family, then domestic adoption, then IA by someone of the same ethnicity, then “other” IA…
I would first off say, that “other” IA is not the last resort then…it’s the last option adoption-wise, but really, that chain of priorities implies that life in an orphanage is the choice of last resort.
Well, then how is it “better” or even “compliant” to reduce numbers of IA if there are still children in SWIs?
October 10th, 2007 at 10:11 am
Last night my wife and I went to adoption dinner get together that a group in our city has once a month. I would say there was probably 50 to 60 people there including the adopted children who were ALL adorable. ALOT of people we talked to who adopted from China first are now switching and going to Vietnam, Korea or Guatemala for their second child. Lets face reality folks the China program is NOT what it used to be when it gave out 1 full month of referrals at a time. If you don’t want to go special needs or wait at least 2 or 3 years, I’d think about switching.
October 10th, 2007 at 10:24 am
WOW!! What can I say after reading this… But I guess we kind of new all this, it’s just that reading the actual words makes it more real, doesn’t it?.
Just a question though, why are we so worried about what the CCAA should or shouldn’t say? I think we should put more pressure on the agencies. Our agency is a China only one and they boast of having a great relationship with the Chinese government. Based on experience and on many years of doing this, shouldn’t they be on a position to tell us what might be the more likely scenario?
We entered this (LID April 2007) knowing that the wait time was 14 to 18 months. Then I started hearing that time MIGHT lenghten. The idea of 2 years started floating around. Now 3 or more?
Sorry, I guess I’m going on and on.. But what about putting pressure on our agencies?
October 10th, 2007 at 10:32 am
Just a question: shouldn’t we put pressure on our agencies to tell us what is going on and what is more likely to happen? Surely our China only agency (which by the way boasts of an excellent relationship with the Chinese Gov.) should have an idea even if the CCAA doesn’t share much info.
October 10th, 2007 at 10:43 am
Oh! and to all 2007 LID’s (ours is April 2007) let’s hold hands!!! Imagine there’s still all of 2006 to get through!!!! I’m getting quite sad with everything I’ve been reading (although I thank this site and RQ) and I too wonder what to do. But for now we’re still on and not switching to another program: I like the analogy with the supermaket line moving faster when you swith to another one. And then lets not forget the ancient Chinese proverb, the one about that red thread that connects us with those we are destined to meet and love… I guess we just have to patiently untangle it little by little.
October 10th, 2007 at 10:46 am
hi rq,
when you get a chance this month can you talk about the ministry of civil affairs in china. although we get frustrated with the ccaa for the wait, there is always “the guy who wakes the bugler up”-sorry,navy analogy. but isn’t it true that the ccaa is under the ministry of civil affairs? i have a hard time blaming the ccaa when they have been very happy to make plenty of matches in the past. they matched my dd1 to us.
also can you go into more detail and review the reasoning behind the speed up/slow down theories.
one last thing- has anyone heard in the past lets say 20 yrs, have there been waits as long as 4 yrs in IA?
thanks so much rq for all the food for thought and for having this site.
October 10th, 2007 at 11:32 am
We have a June 07 LID and a dear friend has Sept 07 LID. This is very discouraging. I don’t know what to think anymore. I continue to pray and hope.
October 10th, 2007 at 11:44 am
And so we know what we always know….. NOTHING!
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
October 10th, 2007 at 11:59 am
The “ancient Chinese proverb” red thread has to do with lovers and marriage connected by fate, not parents in any way, shape or form. The way a-parents use it, it’s not an “ancient Chinese proverb”, but an adoptive parent’s proverb seeking to find a connection to our kids. Still fate – but very different as to what it means and the real origins.
The writing is on the wall – China adoption is NOT going back to the way it was. China does NOT WANT to be the world’s largest supplier of babies any more. As a rising country, they want to take care of their own orphans. The problem isn’t a lack of children, or staff to refer them… but that China, plain and simple, doesn’t want to refer out so many NSN children. They want to keep them in country, and care for them, themselves. That IS their right – regardless whether we can supply better homes and lives for the kids.
October 10th, 2007 at 1:54 pm
Sigh. What is there to say? Every month we are all left with the same choice: Stay and wait, or go. I honestly believe that China’s IA program remains viable, just not the same as it once was. The wait is so frustrating and I wish there were a way to make CCAA understand that if we just knew the straight facts, we might not like what they are but we would at least (finally) know exactly what we are dealing with. But our cultures are so very different when it comes to disseminating information that the only time any of us will truly have the most important fact in place is when we’re looking at our referrals. And I REALLY wish my own agency would get a clue and starting talking to its clients more directly and more frequently! I mean, really, I expect CCAA to behave the way it does but I had hoped for better on this end of things. They were very chatty during our first adoption a few years ago, when everything was so swift. But when there are problems, they just clam up. Not professional. Or kind.
I’ll stay and wait. It will be worth it.
October 10th, 2007 at 2:34 pm
China adoption is NOT, does NOT WANT, they want to….
And you know this as fact?
No doubt we all want what is best for these children and we all understand that in an ideal world China could take care of their own. If In fact they don’t want us I wish they would cut us loose. Thousands of people are looking to complete their families through adoption from China. China opened their doors to us and invited us in. We are not taking their Children from them, they are intrusting them to us. I do think, in the best interests of the children of the world, China should be forthcoming with their intentions for the program. It isn’t just the potential loss for the Children that might remain in orphanages in China but also for children elsewhere as parents age out of options.
October 10th, 2007 at 3:59 pm
How harsh but thanks for clarifying the “red thread” proverb! I guess it works for us: this belief that somehow, somewhere there is a little girl who will one day be such part of our family that it doesn’t matter where or how she came to us: it was meant to be!
October 10th, 2007 at 4:32 pm
Thanks for the insightful post and replies. We returned home with our twenty month old daughter seven weeks ago. (Still addicted to this site, you see.) Our agency is large, China only. Our daughter is from Guangdong province so we were in Guangzhou the whole time. Our two in China reps had been with the agency a long time (10 years and 7 years.) Both very experienced and knowledgeable. When we asked about the future of China adoption, it was their opinion that the trend is leaning towards building up the SN program and way scaling back on NSN. Again, this was their opinion based on first hand experience. Only time will tell the real story.
We adpopted our daughter through the SN program and she is an absolute dream come true! Thanks RQ and all the best to those waiting. It will happen!
October 10th, 2007 at 5:28 pm
SherryInVermont,
I agree with what you are saying. I think your perception of this is right.
October 10th, 2007 at 6:09 pm
Sharingjoy, i’m so sorry for your struggle with B/C….. I know an incredible clinic, where Miracles do happen, if you want…… you can email me……
Shelley
October 10th, 2007 at 6:18 pm
Well, I think I need to light a fall scented candle, curl up with a good book, and (try to) escape the reality of life for a while…..with an April o7…..ugh, this is sad….
DaisyandCamilo: I think we may share the same agency and although I truly believe they have an amazing staff of genuine and kind people….either they don’t know, can’t tell, or just won’t tell….I agree it seems odd that one could have such a close relationship and yet be left in the dark. But I wonder if all the agencies boast of the same close bond……whatever the case, it’s all just heartbreaking….
RQ- thank you again, if our path’s ever cross in this lifetime, dinner is on us :-) You’re a blessing to our family…
October 10th, 2007 at 6:27 pm
sharingjoy,
Thanks for praying for us….please know that you now have one more family praying for you as well.
October 10th, 2007 at 8:40 pm
The other day one of my co-workers said…”How’s that adoption thing going. Are you still working on that?” Can you imagine being pregnant and the gestation period extending longer than normal and receiving a comment like that. It’s like we have so many choices if we’re adopting. How untrue.
My agency asked me if I wanted to switch programs to another country. My husband and I prayed about it for a while but I know my son is already there in China waiting for us. I’ve seen his face a thousand times even though I’ve never touched his little hands. To switch now would be to walk away from him. I want to be a mother so bad but I want to be HIS mother. We’ve asked for a son, age 2-4 so he is already there waiting for us.
I will wait this out until the CCAA tells me NO, it is not going to happen. For those of you who are waiting as well, my prayers are with you every day.
Susan
LID June 2006
October 10th, 2007 at 11:36 pm
I think the key thing here is we cannot trust what CCAA says.
I agree with the comment that I think they say things to try to keep the peace but it is really just a power trip!!!
The best we could hope for is things keep rolling along. (slow as they might be) As long as it keeps going forward there is hope. As far as trying to make them speed up or try and force CCAA to tell us the truth, Well in History when has this tactic really worked? I feel if CCAA starting getting real pressure from media and governments about there international adoption program. They would show there true colors and really stick it to all the families waiting for there child. Just to show everyone who is really in charge!!!
Now I think what we should do is to try (and it’s hard) to stay positive and just hope the program at worst case stays the same!!!
Thank God December is Finally here!!!
Scott… LID 12/29/05
October 11th, 2007 at 12:01 am
I have to agree with Sherry in Vermont & dmp. China’s primary interest is not in providing us with children just because we submitted a dossier. China’s first interest is what’s best for China. China does not think nor operate like the US/Europe-they control and strategically supply information. Expecting the CCAA to give us an honest answer will likely never happen. It would be nice, and I too wish that we would be given some detailed information. I too am equally frustrated given I have been waiting a very long time for a referral and spent a great deal of money along the way, which by the way, is not tax deductable unless the adoption is completed. It’s seems fairly obvious that the writing is on the wall. China’s IA program has changed-they are referring more SN children, less NSN and the wait is a complete unknown at this point which I believe is not only emotionally painful, but also unethical.
Sorry to sound so negative, but I’m not optimistic that things will change. Just review the articles on the BBC & you can get a good idea of what factors are coming in to play. I do however, feel that our agencies should provide more realistic timeframes for referrals.
October 11th, 2007 at 8:39 am
This every lengthening delay is just great for the SN kids in China. Kids that might never have a chance for a mom and dad suddenly “are in” and that includes older children up to age 13. How many of them have watched over the years as all the cute little babies were adopted out of their SWI’s? How many asked their ayis why they weren’t being adopted? How many feel “they’re done, cooked, toast, unlucky, through?” Some of these kids could have been doctors or teachers or international finance guys. But they and we will never know. Now, they have a chance to fulfill their dreams of having a family and a chance at a better life. And so, even with a LID of 4-06-06 we are considering a 10 year old girl. If this goes through we will help her fulfill her dreams.
Drew
October 11th, 2007 at 9:27 am
This is the first time that I have ever sent a message to this site although look almost every day. we started the process of adoption over two years ago and have a LID of sept 2006 I am age 51 and my husband is 50. We thought that we had laid the “being childless ghost to rest ” Probably because we were protecting ourselves from failure. Today I feel that there is a very good chance that we may fail at this because of the wait involved and that we will be too old, and question if we are being selfish to go ahead at our age.
Here in the U.K. on Monday “China`s stolen Children ” was shown which for those who did not see it showed the problems within China of children being sold by desperate parents, who had had a child illegally. the trafficker spoke openly of how he had sold his own son. If these parents can sell their children within China , I can understand that for some parents this would be preferable to abandoning their child . could this account for a downturn in available babies?.
October 11th, 2007 at 11:40 am
yviefaye,
I’ve read 10% of children are being raised by their grandparents who are older than you are. We adopted our first at your present age and now in line for a second.
With exercise and a good nutrition program you can function more effectively than many 40 year olds. And your years of life experiences provide much wisdom.
Do it.
October 11th, 2007 at 12:10 pm
yviefaye,
I’m 59 and my wife just turned 48. We have an LID of 12/19 so if we’re not next we’re very close to being there. We have a beautiful 5 year old from the city of Luo Yang in Henan Province that came to us when she was 21 months. We also have a 19 year old biological son. Being an older parent (I was 40 at his birth) and now having a much younger daughter has kept both my wife and I young. At the age we are I find I’m at the peak of my earning years and can offer much to the comfort level of my family. I keep myself in good physical shape by walking at least a mile each day and expect to live to be 100. Being older parents give us more wisdom and experience than many younger folks haven’t had the opportunity yet to gain, so don’t sell yourself short for being a bit more mature. Age is only in the mind of the beholder and you won’t fail as a parent simply by being a bit more mature. You’ll do fine..
October 11th, 2007 at 12:17 pm
Hi!
This also is my first time adding a comment though I have lurked on occasion!! I am from Ireland and have a beautiful daughter who came home from China in 2005, after a process that lasted over 4 years (due to our long assessment process here) We now have our second pack just about ready to submit so the slow down and the prospect of an even longer wait is most disheartning. Is there anybody out there who can give any glimmer of hope to people at our stage or are we building our hopes on quicksand?
October 11th, 2007 at 12:55 pm
Muireann,
Good for you that your are starting again. Our first adoption was in 03 waits where 14 months and getting longer. Travel was shut down about 3 months. None the less I was surprised when we got our referral 4 months earlier than planned. When we started the process in 06 waits where short 6-10 months. So things change, it might be that after the eyes of the world are no longer on China they speed up again. We don’t know what China is doing. The “writing on the wall” as I see it is that China continues to accept NSN applications. How come? They could implement a quota, they have in the past. Why haven’t. they? Well IMHO they will speed up according to some plan they have. It won’t have an impact on me and many waiting but I bet it will for you. Again IMHO I think a big clue about Chinas intentions for the program are what they do, and what they are doing is accepting applications. Some have a theory that China is slowing rather than closing to avoid bad press. If image is a concern I don’t think they would continue accept applications from all over the world and not follow through.
October 11th, 2007 at 1:48 pm
I’ve been running like a chicken without a head for the last few days wondering what to do.. what to think… how to read things between the lines… I’ve just had 3 chocolate chip cookies in the course of this morning alone! Funny comments aside (although all of it is true), I thank the last few comments! We too are worried about the time frame lengthening because of our age and the gap between our 5 year old daughter and her future sister. We had it all worked out in our minds, we very so looking forward to another car seat, the interaction between the two girls, oh! so much! I guess we all do…
October 11th, 2007 at 2:17 pm
Hi, this is my first time on this blog. I am waiting for my I171 approval and so anticipate having my dossier sent by the end of the month.
I am not sure what to do about this wait time. Should I tell my agency that I am hearing all these rumors and want to know what they know, since they don’t tell us anything? Is it possible that we may actually never receive a referral? I really am at a loss as to what to do, if anything.
October 11th, 2007 at 3:30 pm
I have talked to my agency and I get more insight into what’s going on here on RQ.
I don’t think the issue is “if but more “when”. How long are you willing to wait? Can you wait 3 years? Figure out your limits, set a time line, and a back up plan. Live your life and in a year if the outlook looks worse rather than better, decide if you will wait another year to see if things change or implement your up plan.
October 11th, 2007 at 5:24 pm
That is good advice Mays Mom, thanks!
October 11th, 2007 at 8:00 pm
Thanks for taking the time to source out this information and pass it on. I have no doubt that EVERYONE is hoping for a pick up in the pace… but as RAYRDT said – only time will tell.
October 11th, 2007 at 8:16 pm
If I had another viable option I would take it.
For those older parents with no kids what about taking say an older child on from a WC list? Yeah you might have to switch agencies, and start paperwork again but it is a shame not to become a parent. Our country has very few intercountry programs hence lack of choice. Those of you in the States have MANY MANY MANY options we just don’t have – check them out!! One agency WC list in States has a healthy 12 yo boy, no one is taking him up?? Now a couple age 55 would be perfect for him. Sure it is not the healthy baby girl dream that many of us have, but lets face reality, we want to get past this and move on with our lives… CCAA is not giving us info we can make reliable decisions on.. the sooner we can all get past this hold up the better for all of us!!
October 11th, 2007 at 9:12 pm
yviefaye,
Do not give up. I truly believe all of us who wait this out will be blessed with a child. I truly believe China wants the best for their children and recognizes the benefits of international adoption. I also believe the majority of parents who give up their child for adoption do so because of circumstances beyond their control, regardless of their culture and country.
I read through these messages as I wait for our referral and still believe they are filled with hope and faith that everything is under control.
Rumor Queen…bless you for caring and providing a venue for us to meet.
Susan
LID June 06
October 12th, 2007 at 4:35 pm
RQ-
Thank you for doing what you do! As many here have said, my agency told me 14-16 months; could get longer OR shorter, they said. What drives me crazy is that I have to come here to get a real picture of things. When I talk to my agency, they are so vague and overly optimistic, saying things like “we’ve seen this happen before in 2001.” No you haven’t — but I only know that because I found this site!
With a March 2007 LID, I like many of you, just keep hoping things might change.
October 12th, 2007 at 5:59 pm
………….modern day “Chinese Torture”………
October 14th, 2007 at 1:24 am
RQ
Was this a US based agency that was matched ahead,or from another county?